Investment Property

[appleman_thai]

Hello to one and all.

Well after 4 years in the Kingdom I am just about to work up the courage to buy some property here. I have been looking for a long time in many different areas including Bangkok, Hua Hin, Koh Chang and Phuket. I have 2 reasons to invest. The first is to have somewhere to live in Bangkok and to pay off a mortgage every month rather than paying rent. The rent I am paying now should easily cover the mortgage that I am applying for (I should get confirmation on that any day soon). The second is purely for investment reasons and perhaps to give me somewhere to go on weekends or holidays.

So now I am finalizing an offer on a Condo in Paholyothin – near Victory Monument. I am quite happy with the location and the building. The price also looks reasonable (working out at 49k baht per sqm not including balcony and 45k baht including balcony). It will require some renovations but nothing too big.

I am also actively looking at buying in Hua Hin. I go there regularly for weekends and really love the place. Of course its getting more popular but I am hoping that is something that will help on the demand for rentals.

I looked at 2 places seriously and have seen many many other places. The first is Paradise Village, West of Hua Hin near the Elephant Village. 3 Bed, 220sqm living, 480 sqm land for 4.5m. Second, is the Orchid/Lotus/Jasmine Development from Asia Property Centre, South of Hua Hin on Soi 112. This also is 3 bed, 170sqm and 450sqm land and is going for 5.9million. Granted the quality of the building and general professionalism was a lot better but is it really worth paying that much more?

Does anyone have any info on either of these developments that they would like to share?

Finally, the reason for buying is mainly as an investment and therefore I need someone to rent the property from me. I am told from the Agents of Paradise Village that I could get 30k for peak season (5 months) and the rest is hit and miss. I am told by Asia Property Centre that I can get 30k per month all year round and that they have a waiting list. Well, can I really get that 30k? I looked at rental prices online and in newspapers and I have seem places on the beach for 20k per month. Would people really pay 30k? Is there enough farangs living there longterm who want to rent out at 30k?

If someone living in Hua Hin could give me a better indication of the rental market that would be great – thanks

[malcolminthemiddle]

....................... The rent I am paying now should easily cover the mortgage that I am applying for (I should get confirmation on that any day soon).  ............................

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

From http://www.huahinafterdark.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1848

quote "Has anyone heard anything about getting local finance? I am working here already 4 years with full work permit. I have all the right demographics but am looking for a Bank who is willing to lend to a foreigner to buy thai property. I have heard HSBC target the expat market – any confirmation on this?" quote

[appleman_thai]

Malcolm,

Whats your point?

Yes, I posted on another board. Surely thats OK? The Hua Hin post only related to the Hua Hin Property.....

Have you got some information that you are willing to share?

[malcolminthemiddle]

Malcolm,

Whats your point?

Yes, I posted on another board.  Surely thats OK?  The Hua Hin post only related to the Hua Hin Property.....

Have you got some information that you are willing to share?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Apologies, if I misunderstood your posts.

Kindly post the name of the bank willing to give you a mortgage on a BKK condo. I'm sure many of us would be interested.

Thanks.

[trajan]

HSBC gives mortgages to foreigners, but medium term like 10 years.....why dont you try them?....

also I recently read that Bangkok Bank was offering mortgages to foreigners. They might be able to arrange something

[appleman_thai]

Actually, thought that I had replied to this post already but it didnt appear.

No problem for misunderstanding.

I am applying for mortgage through Siam Commercial Bank. IN principle they have no problem lending to a farang for a condo. Some restrictions include living and working with permit in Thailand for more than 4 years, they only lend 70% and you have to show repayment capacity and statements (obvious really).

BUt for Hua Hin I want to buy a house so SCB wont do. I will look further at HSBC.

THanks

[Teach]

Hello to one and all.

Well after 4 years in the Kingdom I am just about to work up the courage to buy some property here.  I have been looking for a long time in many different areas including Bangkok, Hua Hin, Koh Chang and Phuket.  I have 2 reasons to invest.  The first is to have somewhere to live in Bangkok and to pay off a mortgage every month rather than paying rent.  The rent I am paying now should easily cover the mortgage that I am applying for (I should get confirmation on that any day soon).  The second is purely for investment reasons and perhaps to give me somewhere to go on weekends or holidays.

So now I am finalizing an offer on a Condo in Paholyothin – near Victory Monument.  I am quite happy with the location and the building.  The price also looks reasonable (working out at 49k baht per sqm not including balcony and 45k baht including balcony).  It will require some renovations but nothing too big.

I am also actively looking at buying in Hua Hin.  I go there regularly for weekends and really love the place.  Of course its getting more popular but I am hoping that is something that will help on the demand for rentals.

I looked at 2 places seriously and have seen many many other places.  The first is Paradise Village, West of Hua Hin near the Elephant Village.  3 Bed, 220sqm living, 480 sqm land for 4.5m.  Second, is the Orchid/Lotus/Jasmine Development from Asia Property Centre, South of Hua Hin on Soi 112.  This also is 3 bed, 170sqm and 450sqm land and is going for 5.9million.  Granted the quality of the building and general professionalism was a lot better but is it really worth paying that much more?

Does anyone have any info on either of these developments that they would like to share?

Finally, the reason for buying is mainly as an investment and therefore I need someone to rent the property from me.  I am told from the Agents of Paradise Village that I could get 30k for peak season (5 months) and the rest is hit and miss.  I am told by Asia Property Centre that I can get 30k per month all year round and that they have a waiting list.  Well, can I really get that 30k?  I looked at rental prices online and in newspapers and I have seem places on the beach for 20k per month.  Would people really pay 30k?  Is there enough farangs living there longterm who want to rent out at 30k?

If someone living in Hua Hin could give me a better indication of the rental market that would be great – thanks

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Are you looking to acquire mortgages on both properties????

If you are renting the Hua Hin residence you will hardly be able to spend weekends there??

Renting only 5 months during peak season sounds more likely, thereby draining the investment opportunity??

Presently paying anything in the multi million bracket for property in HH is premium pricing which in itself will take a number of years to recoup. Add to that the current downturn in the property market generally and it could well be many years if at all before you see an actual profit from your endeavour.

T.

[bkkexplorer]

Just curious, how are yuo buying landed property in HH? In your name, missus name or through a company? Thanks.

[appleman_thai]

Are you looking to acquire mortgages on both properties????

If you are renting the Hua Hin residence you will hardly be able to spend weekends there??

Renting only 5 months during peak season sounds more likely, thereby draining the investment opportunity??

Presently paying anything in the multi million bracket for property in HH is premium pricing which in itself will take a number of years to recoup. Add to that the current downturn in the property market generally and it could well be many years if at all before you see an actual profit from your endeavour.

T.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes I am looking for 2 mortgages.... condo of 70% and as much as I can get for Hua Hin.

Yes, I would hope to rent out HH on long term... ideally 1 year but any other combinations - monthly, weekly could work. It all depends on how much I can get on the rent. Thats what I am really asking.

As regards the property market..........where are the signs that it is slowing down?

[Eric Davis]

Buy yourself some land and build your own house on it. 5million is mad money to spend.

[malcolminthemiddle]

Are you looking to acquire mortgages on both properties????

If you are renting the Hua Hin residence you will hardly be able to spend weekends there??

Renting only 5 months during peak season sounds more likely, thereby draining the investment opportunity??

Presently paying anything in the multi million bracket for property in HH is premium pricing which in itself will take a number of years to recoup. Add to that the current downturn in the property market generally and it could well be many years if at all before you see an actual profit from your endeavour.

T.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes I am looking for 2 mortgages.... condo of 70% and as much as I can get for Hua Hin.

Yes, I would hope to rent out HH on long term... ideally 1 year but any other combinations - monthly, weekly could work. It all depends on how much I can get on the rent. Thats what I am really asking.

As regards the property market..........where are the signs that it is slowing down?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Developers selling land.

[Dakhar]

While I do respect the opinion of the above post, and I think logically he has a point... I can say that my town houses are full of renters, and as soon as one person moves out, the empty unit is rented out within hours. No kidding. But the town houses are set up for the Thai market. I intend on doing another town house complex in the near future. The difficult part seems to be getting the land where I want it.

[appleman_thai]

Dakhar,

What kind of rental income are they paying? For how many sqm? I just want to get an idea if there is a market for people renting at 30,000 baht per month. THe agents say there is but I would like to hear an independent view.

On the good news SCB have approved my mortgage so it IS possible to get local financing to buy a condo.

Bad news is that the seller wont budge on his price..... crazy logic really. THe place has been empty for 8 years. He never rented it. All the other condos are occupied. He just says he has enough cash and doesnt need the hassle of renting. So why will he not negotiate on his price? He is asking WAY over the market value.....??!?!?! I jsut dont get it.

So now I am looking elsewhere in Bangkok - Supalai Park Tower near the IMAX in Ratchayothin........looks interesting......

Still havent given up on the HH idea either!

[Nepal4me]

Dakhar,

What kind of rental income are they paying?  For how many sqm?  I just want to get an idea if there is a market for people renting at 30,000 baht per month.  THe agents say there is but I would like to hear an independent view.

On the good news SCB have approved my mortgage so it IS possible to get local financing to buy a condo.

Bad news is that the seller wont budge on his price..... crazy logic really.  THe place has been empty for 8 years.  He never rented it.  All the other condos are occupied.  He just says he has enough cash and doesnt need the hassle of renting.  So why will he not negotiate on his price?  He is asking WAY over the market value.....??!?!?!  I jsut dont get it.

So now I am looking elsewhere in Bangkok - Supalai Park Tower near the IMAX in Ratchayothin........looks interesting......

Still havent given up on the HH idea either!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What interest rate is SCB giving you on you loan? Bangkok Bank in Singapore will also loan up to 70% of the price of a condo in Thailand and currently are charging 6% interest if you pay in Sing dollars, 6.5% if you pay in US dollars.

BTW, it seems that Thai landlords/owners have a price in mind and they stick to it, whether it's market price or not. There have been long threads on this board on that subject.

[appleman_thai]

They are charging me the MLR - currently 5.75%.

An they will only give 70% too.

BUt all in all the repayments are less than my rent at the moment!

[Digger]

SCB will lend on houses - just be sure to tell the bank that you want to borrow the money as the company that owns the house and land NOT in your own name. If you have been approved by SCB for a condo, odds are you will also be approved for a house. Basically to follow the law the loan is made in the name of the owning company but they credit rate the ability of the company to repay on your individual credit status. Once you get your head around this part, it actually makes sense in a Thai sort of way. I have had multiple mortgages with SCB at the same time for many different houses and land. I have even heard of them giving mortgages for people not even working here which sounds crazy but true.

This has always been done in Pattaya branches and they have a lot of knowledge of it. One additional point, SCB have a uncommon authorisation process for loans. Basically, as I understand it, anything under 5m baht is approved by the manager in the branch, between 5m-30m its done by specialist lending mgrs at regional office and above 30M it has to be approved by BKK head office. Most other banks require all loans to be approved by special depts in BKK. That might explain how they do what they do, at least in Pattaya. Therefore it might be worth enquiring of SCB brnach in Hua Hin and not mentioning that you are considering a condo in BKK - odds are that they will never put two and two together as the housing loan is in the name of the company and condo loan in your name.

Just an idea !!

[appleman_thai]

Digger,

Thanks for advice and suggestions.

However, I would feel a bit dodgy going to SC in HH and not disclosing my dealings with SCB in Bang Khen..... and Im sure they would find out too....... how could they not??!?!?!? I know it would be in the company name but surely they would check out my own personal bank accounts first....?!?!?!?

Anyway, I will try to put the Bankok condo to bed first and then move onto HH.

THe first condo I made an offer on in BKK is a no go. THe seller wont budge on his price.

So instead I am going to buy in Supalai Park. Its a decent development - a little expensive (isnt everything) but I think it should hold its value at least......

[Dakhar]

Dakhar,

What kind of rental income are they paying?  For how many sqm?  I just want to get an idea if there is a market for people renting at 30,000 baht per month.  THe agents say there is but I would like to hear an independent view.

On the good news SCB have approved my mortgage so it IS possible to get local financing to buy a condo.

Bad news is that the seller wont budge on his price..... crazy logic really.  THe place has been empty for 8 years.  He never rented it.  All the other condos are occupied.  He just says he has enough cash and doesnt need the hassle of renting.  So why will he not negotiate on his price?  He is asking WAY over the market value.....??!?!?!  I jsut dont get it.

So now I am looking elsewhere in Bangkok - Supalai Park Tower near the IMAX in Ratchayothin........looks interesting......

Still havent given up on the HH idea either!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You are going to hate me with what little info I am going to give you, because I really do not know a lot about the houses. I mean, sure I have the plans, but off the top of my head, I don't know the fine details. But this is what I can tell you....

They are designed for the Thai market. No hot water, no AC, no kitchen, it is a 7 unit, 2 floor, 2 room dwelling, 1 bath town house complex. They rent for 3K baht a month for the inner units, and 3,500 baht for the 2 outer units. The wife claims that there should be a difference in price, because the outer 2 units have more windows. I guess she is right, regardless, they rent out fast. For the units I/she paid around 75K USD for a turn key operation, including taxes.

So we are looking at a return on investment (ROI) of around 9% before tax......

I have been told many times that if I were to attempt to build another complex, costs would be much more expensive. I don't know if that it really the case, but it is just what I have been told.

[appleman_thai]

OK. Here is the update.

The last 2 months have been a rollercoaster ride (up and down like a whores knickers!). I have learned so much about property in Thailand and still have so much more to go..............its a neverending struggle (or challenge).

At the end of the day, I have bought a Condo near Central Lad Phrao. I got a mortgage from SCB Bank - currently only 58% but i'm still negotiating to have this increased to 70%.

The main advice I have for anyone doing anything relating to property here is to take your time and be very very very patient!!!!!.......

Q. How much research and how long does it take you to decide on buying a new phone for approx 10 - 20k? Now consider you are investing upwards of 6 MILLION for property...... do the maths!!!

[appleman_thai]

I managed to secure the 70% but now I am having problems with my lawyer who states that the land office will not register my ownership unless the mortgage is from a Non resident account. However, the bank will not set up a Non Residnt account.

Yet another obstacle to overcome.

[gamb00ler]

My wife, stepson and I live in a condo at Supalai that we bought about 18 months ago. We're somewhat disappointed with the quality/operation. I'll be happy to share our experience with you. Reply to this thread and send me a PM with your e-mail or phone # and I'll be sure to contact you very soon. But, we're returning to the US and won't be available after Oct. 16.

Gamb00ler