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[Plus]

Quote

anti-globalisation corporate monopolists who ended up supporting the feudalist coup

Who are these people? I can think of only Uncle Prachai, PAD had taken his money, but when elections came he flopped - no one supports his cause.

[samran]

younghusband, on 2008-06-19 04:27:36, said:

Sorry if I interpreted your views on the Shin deal incorrectly.It's just that there was so much half informed little Thailander nonsense spouted about this transaction at the time,inspired by the very same anti-globalisation corporate monopolists who ended up supporting the feudalist coup.To some extent the lower middle class supporters of PAD, though in some cases with decent intentions, acted as a Thai counterpart of Lenin's "useful fools" ie a mass movement providing ballast for the inefficient Thai monopolists who loathe international competition.Anyway what's done is done and the the major international investors including the increasingly important Sovereign Wealth Funds simply ignore Thailand, not least because of the Temasek experience.Temasek investment in Shin would have been good for Thailand but the opportunity has passed in a welter of ersatz nationalism, lies and vested interests.

Of course Thaksin's move was politically inept and there is a debate to be had on the tax side (whatever the detail of the latter there is no easy glib answer).

No stress.

As I've actually said, I think we share many of the same views, especially with respect to economics. I'm pretty anti-establishment economically and pro-competition in many respects. I'm all for getting rid of monopolies.

As for foreign investment ignoring Thailand. At a superficial level I guess this is true. But dig deeper and I think the main reason many of these funds ignore Thailand is a combination of two things:

1) Firstly, 90% of Thai companies listed on the SET do a crap job in marketing themselves to investors. I regularly work with/am exposed to a couple of SET listed clients who aren't like that, and their ultimate levels of foreign ownership reach up to 60% through various methods. They are well on the radar of foriegn investors who have a plethora of investment options, and if the Thai companies don't go knocking on their door, then the investor isn't going to know about it. Additionally, their corporate communications are shite....

2) Many of the players listed on the SET really shouldn't be listed. It seems a bit of a status symbol to be listed there. So there are quite literally a bunch of 'Somchai Rayong Brick production Public Company' equivalents on the SET, who's only operation is one tiny factory located in the Baan nok industrial zone. The small operation, combined with an illiquid float on the SET (due to the company founders still holding 95% of all shares) means that even if they were on the radar of a fund, they wouldn't want to invest given they can't enter and exit their investment easily without affectiing the price.

The list below gives you an idea of the SET companies that a foreign fund would be interested in. It isn't very extensive for the reasons I outline above.  

http://content.membe...d...C||,00.html

[hammered]

From TOC

Quote

Police once again played loud music over the speeches of PAD leaders. The PAD rally retaliated by playing loud music of their own. PAD leader Sondhi Limthongkul told the PAD supporters to stay calm.

Quite what that has to do with upholding the law in a democracy who knows. That the police have started to act in a way expected in an authoritarian police state rather than a democracy does not auger well for short term future.

[hammered]

Quote

POLITICAL TENSION
Govt House cordoned off
By The Nation
Published on June 19, 2008


PAD plans to over-run administration compound

Army chief General Anupong Paochinda and Police chief Patcharawat Wongsuwan held a tense meeting yesterday afternoon with Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej to devise a plan on how to prevent the People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) from taking over the Government House compound tomorrow.

Following the meeting, Patcharawat said the police would only allow the PAD to hold its rally at the Makhawan Rangsan Bridge and would use all means possible to block the rally from moving to Government House tomorrow.


The police plan to bring in more than 3,000 officers to ensure security around Government House.


Police Lt-General Vichien-chote Sukchotirat, the Govern-ment House spokesman, issued a warning: "The PAD has committed itself to becoming either a coup-maker or a traitor," he said.


"The protesters can't besiege Government House, which is the symbol of democracy and of the administration. When they stage a coup, they have to take over Government House. If they are successful, we call it a coup or a reform. If not successful, we call it the act of a traitor.

From the Nation. Rest at: http://www.nationmul...es_30075931.php

The spokesperson seems to be quite unintelligible. Interesting that there used to be demos outside government house every year and that now they are suddenly off limits. Definitely a step in the wrong direction in a democratic society. I rememeber one that went on for ages and during which the Chuan Leekpai government managed to carry on functioning as well as the parliament, something that doesnt seem to happen these days.
Of course an invasion of government house would be a more serious matter but a peaceful demonstration not being allowed to demonstrate near the government in a new precedent for Thailand.
The movement of the police from being upholders of the law, which I guess includes the constitutional right to assemble and demonstrate peacefully, to a position of increasingly trying to undermine opponents of the government is a worrying development too.
The sides are lining up in as the lust for power comes to a head. It is a kind of shame that nobody is thinkiing of bigger issues as the world economy deteriorates, but I guess for some pure personal feud victories are far more important than what happens to the country.

[sriracha john]

and just to escalate things further... the mob of hired thugs are promising to come out on Friday... and are looking to take over the police force's area of responsibility....


Anti-PAD rally threatened if PAD beseiges Government House

People Power Party MP Pracha Prasopdee on Thursday threatened to mobilise a counter protest if the People's Alliance for Democracy goes ahead to beseige the seat of government Friday.

"Anti-PAD protesters will congregate at Sanam Luang to assess the situation should police fail to deter the PAD from moving to Government House," Pracha said.

- The Nation

[sriracha john]

but then again, perhaps the event won't even make it to Friday...


Chamlong Believes Police Will Try to Disperse PAD Tonight

At around 2 a.m. this morning key PAD leader Chamlong Srimuang revealed that police have cancelled the plan to disperse the supporters of the PAD who are scheduled to move their protest to Government House on Friday.

However Chamlong says he believes the police will try, once again, to disperse the protesters tonight before they are able to begin to gather and move to the Government House.  

- Thailand Outlook (today)

[Moonrakers]

sriracha john, on 2008-06-19 12:46:18, said:

and just to escalate things further... the mob of hired thugs are promising to come out on Friday... and are looking to take over the police force's area of responsibility....


Anti-PAD rally threatened if PAD beseiges Government House

People Power Party MP Pracha Prasopdee on Thursday threatened to mobilise a counter protest if the People's Alliance for Democracy goes ahead to beseige the seat of government Friday.

"Anti-PAD protesters will congregate at Sanam Luang to assess the situation should police fail to deter the PAD from moving to Government House," Pracha said.

- The Nation

What a fuc*ing contradiction, so the PAD, or any anti government group are not allowed to protest but anything pro-government are encouraged to do so.

Also:

Quote

"The PAD has committed itself to becoming either a coup-maker or a traitor,"

At what point have the PAD committed themselves to this action??? Maybe they do have this intention, I don't really know, but they have not "committed" themselves to this until they try to do so.

I really do hope that somebody pulls Samak aside and "Has a word", otherwise I fear for the worst.

Edited by globalj, 2008-06-19 12:55:21.

[hammered]

sriracha john, on 2008-06-19 12:46:18, said:

and just to escalate things further... the mob of hired thugs are promising to come out on Friday... and are looking to take over the police force's area of responsibility....


Anti-PAD rally threatened if PAD beseiges Government House

People Power Party MP Pracha Prasopdee on Thursday threatened to mobilise a counter protest if the People's Alliance for Democracy goes ahead to beseige the seat of government Friday.

"Anti-PAD protesters will congregate at Sanam Luang to assess the situation should police fail to deter the PAD from moving to Government House," Pracha said.

- The Nation

Dont worry Im sure the police are quite capable of denying the PAD their constitutional right to demonstrate. They are already trying to stop demonstatrtors reaching Bangkok and have tried to drown out speeches although God only knows what that has to do with police work.
The anti-PAD gang have the right to demonstrate but the police should be expected to give the same treatment to both sides and to keep them apart. It will be interesting to see if the police play music over the speeches of the anti-PAD demonstrators.
Police neutrality is looking very questionable right now

[hammered]

globalj, on 2008-06-19 12:54:27, said:

sriracha john, on 2008-06-19 12:46:18, said:

and just to escalate things further... the mob of hired thugs are promising to come out on Friday... and are looking to take over the police force's area of responsibility....


Anti-PAD rally threatened if PAD beseiges Government House

People Power Party MP Pracha Prasopdee on Thursday threatened to mobilise a counter protest if the People's Alliance for Democracy goes ahead to beseige the seat of government Friday.

"Anti-PAD protesters will congregate at Sanam Luang to assess the situation should police fail to deter the PAD from moving to Government House," Pracha said.

- The Nation

What a fuc*ing contradiction, so the PAD, or any anti government group are not allowed to protest but anything pro-government are encouraged to do so.

Also:

Quote

"The PAD has committed itself to becoming either a coup-maker or a traitor,"

At what point have the PAD committed themselves to this action??? Maybe they do have this intention, I don't really know, but they have not "committed" themselves to this until they try to do so.

I really do hope that somebody pulls Samak aside and "Has a word", otherwise I fear for the worst.

That final quote is pure politcal hetoric. One can only hope he is an ex-police officer and not speaking on behalf of the police because what he is saying is quite dangerous. Maybe he is just on drugs on the other hand.

[Tony Clifton]

As the police started buzzing around last night, it looked more serious around 2 a.m., Chamlong was sitting amongst the crowd with a microphone and kept reassuring everyone very calmly, even making jokes, everyone seemed very relaxed and not intimidated at all by the police activity going on behind them. He did insist thatno one resist or fight should they start arresting people. A sudden rain shower may have changed plans for the police or they are simply bluffing, I doubt they will take any action as the usual PPP-TRT method is to hire goons who can't be directly linked to anyone.

[Plus]

globalj, on 2008-06-19 12:54:27, said:

I really do hope that somebody pulls Samak aside and "Has a word", otherwise I fear for the worst.

There's a newbie on this board with one post only, but his contribution is quite fitting here.

"Sadly this is a beautiful country being run without any adult supervision".

At this point anyone capable of "having a word" has simply given up and the royal institution is not going to be involved either.

[h90]

Tony Clifton, on 2008-06-19 13:14:40, said:

As the police started buzzing around last night, it looked more serious around 2 a.m., Chamlong was sitting amongst the crowd with a microphone and kept reassuring everyone very calmly, even making jokes, everyone seemed very relaxed and not intimidated at all by the police activity going on behind them. He did insist thatno one resist or fight should they start arresting people. A sudden rain shower may have changed plans for the police or they are simply bluffing, I doubt they will take any action as the usual PPP-TRT method is to hire goons who can't be directly linked to anyone.

I have seen it. Chamlong told very direct, arrest without arrest warrant (spelling??) is illegal and everyone should make pictures of the officers.
If they come without uniform they will get some wood on their heads....
He also read a letter he got from the army.
Read about Chamlong in 1992 and his life on wikipedia. That guy is not silly, he has more brain than the complete government together.

[sriracha john]

Pro-Government Group Prepares for PAD Mass Rally on Friday

A pro-government group, under the leadership of a People Power Party MP, said the group is ready for the People's Alliance for Democracy rally tomorrow at Government House by setting up a counter rally.

The Mahaprachachon Group Leader and People Power Party MP, Pracha Prasobdee, stated in regard to the People's Alliance for Democracy rally set for tomorrow at Government House that Mahaprachachon is to stage a rally against the PAD.

Pracha claimed the PAD rally at Government House will cause trouble for the people. Regarding whether Mahaprachachon will stage the anti-PAD rally, Pracha said it depends on whether the police can handle the situation.

Pracha said Government House is a symbol that represents the image of the nation and national democracy. If the government cannot save Government House, it shows its lack of efficiency in continuing its administrative work.

Regarding the PAD preparing to use the shields with the image of His Majesty the King on them during the mass rally at Government House tomorrow, the Mahaprachachon Group Leader says this will instigate public anger. He said the Mahaprachachon will protect the Monarchy.

Pracha stated that now more people are voluntarily joining his team. He says Mahaprachon is not hoping for the situation to worsen, but the PAD continues to wreak havoc and if chaos does occur the PAD is, therefore, responsible for it.  

Pracha said Mahaprachachon will petition a letter to the Revenue Department on Monday, asking for a check on the amount of financial support being donated from the public to ASTV and the Manager Group's Thaiday Dot Com Company.

- Thailand Outlook (today)

[seagull]

hammered, on 2008-06-19 11:59:19, said:

From TOC

Quote

Police once again played loud music over the speeches of PAD leaders. The PAD rally retaliated by playing loud music of their own. PAD leader Sondhi Limthongkul told the PAD supporters to stay calm.

Quite what that has to do with upholding the law in a democracy who knows. That the police have started to act in a way expected in an authoritarian police state rather than a democracy does not auger well for short term future.

In an authoritarian police state, the PAD would not have gotten past it's first day of protest.

[bubba]

I happened to notice that at around 6:30 PM, there were three large private tour buses pulling in to the Border Police HQ in Phaholyothin Road. If you have followed Thai history regarding coups and protests that turn violent, you may have noted that the Border Police are sometimes the ones called in to do...hmmm...some unsavoury work.

Might it be the the BP are being mobilised for action tonight?

[sriracha john]

The ominous tone from the government increases...


Samak promises no use of military
  
A day before the People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) plans a show of force, Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej vowed the government would not use military force against protesters.

He made no such promise about police, however.

The PAD has planned to stage a mass rally at parliament on Friday. Police said they would not allow them to approach Government House or parliament.

http://www.bangkokpo...s.php?id=128355

[Moonrakers]

I don't know what worries me more, Samak saying that he WILL use the military, or promising NOT to use the military, .

[sriracha john]

Thailand heads for another political showdown

Bangkok - On Friday the People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) will march on Government House to force the resignation of Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej and his cabinet, who have been running the country for less than six months.

There promises to be thousands of peaceful protestors, long speeches, tents set up opposite Government House to protect people from the monsoon rains, food deliveries from unknown backers and, no doubt, a long wait before anything happens. The scene is all too familiar for Bangkokians.

The PAD, a loose coalition of disparate groups united only in their hatred for former premier Thaksin Shinawatra, staged almost daily protests in the capital for much of 2006 until the tanks rolled on to the streets on September 19, ending the political impasse.

Twenty-one months after Thaksin's political downfall and six months after a general election brought the pro-Thaksin People Power Party (PPP) to power, coup rumours are rife again.

"I think the PAD's backing goes very high up and involves military elements, because otherwise they would not be so rabid,' opined Thitinan Pongsudhirak, a political analyst at Thailand's prestigious Chulalongkorn University.

Although the military ousted Thaksin, they could not prevent the proxy PPP from winning the December 23, 2007, general election, and putting in place a 'nominee' cabinet of Thaksin allies.

The PAD returned to the streets on May 25 shortly after the current government began to push for constitutional amendments that are likely to lead to the dismissal of about 16 corruption cases against Thaksin, a billionaire telecommunications tycoon who was prime minister between 2001 to 2006.

The military justified their September coup with charges that Thaksin has been involved in mass corruption, undermined the monarchy and divided the nation.

So far, only the last charge has stuck.

Thaksin, who was banned from entering politics for five years by a constitutional tribunal ruling a year ago, continues to be at the heart of Thailand's political divide.

Although he holds no political post, the hand of Thaksin is seen in whatever the current 'nominee' cabinet does.

For instance, the government's decision this week to support Cambodia in its bid to nominate Preah Vihear, a centuries old Hindu temple on the Thai-Cambodia border as a World Heritage Site, has been seen as part of a sinister business deal, typical of the Thaksin era.

It doesn't help matters that Thai Foreign Minister Noppodon Patama is Thaksin's former lawyer and one day after he disclosed the country's support for Cambodia's Preah Vihear bid, Thaksin announced plans to build a casino-hotel complex on Koh Kong, an island off Cambodia's western coast bordering Thailand.

Pheah Vihear is a sensitive issue for most Thais. The magnificent Hindu temple was the source of a border dispute in the 1950s that ended up in the Hague's International Court. The court decided the temple belonged to Cambodia.

Thailand opposed Cambodia's proposal to list Preah Vihear temple at UNESCO last year on the grounds that the Cambodian site map included still disputed territory.

Cambodia submitted a new map last month, which Noppodon approved this week, paving the way for the temple's lisitng at a UNESCO meeting on July 2, and providing a publicity boost for Cambodian Prime Minister Hun Sen's party in a general election scheduled on July 27.

"It looks like Thailand decided to help Mr Hun Sen in the elections," said Kraisak Choonhavan, a member of the Democrat opposition party.

"The government's way of handling this has created the suspicion that personal gains are more important than national gains," added Kraisak.

That was one of the main complaints against Thaksin's two-term premiership, which increasingly looked like a runaway private gravy train.

Pent up outrage against Thaksin's self-serving government style finally exploded in January 23, 2006, when his family sold their 49 per cent equity in the Thaksin-founded Shin Corp conglomerate to Singapore's Temasek Holding for a tax-free 2 billion dollars.

That gave the PAD the ammunition they needed to mount a a popular anti-Thaksin campaign that finally led to the 2006 coup. Now the PAD is back on the streets for similar reasons.

"I think the Thaksin overhang has been constant," said Thitinan. "This government is not to be trusted, and Thaksin exacerbates that."

Increasingly, with or without a coup, observers are saying that the only long-term solution for the political divide caused by Thaksin is to get Thaksin out of politics for good.

"The only solution is if a court case can quickly come out with a sentence that Thaksin is guilty, then politically he would be out," said Kraisak.

Unfortunately, Thailand's judicial system is notoriously slow and certain elements may not be able to wait for the courts.

- DPA / 19-06-08

[sriracha john]

Police to close all roads leading to Government House this evening

Police on Thursday issued a statement warning motorists to avoid roads surrounding the Government House starting this evening in order to brace for the Friday's protest organised by the People's Alliance for Democracy.

The five roads are Phitsanulok, Ratchasima, Rama V, Sri Ayutthaya and Rajdamnoen Nok. Police will set up road blocks to check vehicles passing the seat of government.

Police said the roads closure was deemed necessary because the PAD might move up its march to this evening from tomorrow at 1 pm.

They also repeated that anti-riot forces were under strict instruction to repel protesters and not to allow the PAD to beseige the Government House.

- The Nation

===========================================================================


Government House officials to take Friday off in light of protest

The security office of Government House on Thursday sent out a circular asking officials to take a day off tomorrow so as not to interfere with security preparations to brace for the besiege by the People's Alliance for Democracy.

All units located within Government House were instructed to order non-essential staff to stay at home and for those reporting to work, not to park vehicles in the compound.

- The Nation

[sriracha john]

NHRC calls on government not to use force against demonstrators  

The National Human Rights Commission (NHRC) requested the government not to use force to disperse a demonstration.

Saneh Chamarik also called on demonstrators to rally peacefully without the use of weapons, adding that the government should not use force with them as they have the right and liberty to stage a demonstration in line with the Constitution and the international human rights standards.

Regarding the issue of Preah Vihear, Saneh says the government did not inform people of the matter enough and it decided on the matter without asking for the parliament’s consent as required by Article 190 of the Constitution.

He also suggested that the government should clarify all issues which affect people and the environment to the public.  

- ThaiNews (today)

[sriracha john]

Wheelin' and Dealin' with the PPP... from a wannabe-like Samak...


PPP Proposes Democrats Negotiate with PAD in Return for Censure Debate
  
A People Power Party MP has urged the opposition Democrat Party to negotiate with the People's Alliance for Democracy to stop the anti-government movement, saying he will ask the government to consider accepting the censure debate motion in exchange.

People Power Party MP for Maha Sarakam, Suthin Klangsaeeng, hosted a press conference today requesting that the Democrat Party help negotiate with the PAD to have them stop the ongoing anti-government movement.

Suthin says if the Democrat Party agreed with his proposal, he will ask the PPP-government to consider accepting the Democrat's censure debate motion submitted for the extraordinary Parliamentary session next month.

Suthin says that according to his plan, he will enlist 80 names of PPP MPs to request that the government consider accepting the debate motion.

When asked for evidence that other PPP MPs supported his opinion, Suthin merely said his prestige as a politician is a guarantee.

However, he said that personally, he agreed with the PPP-led government not to extend the special Parliamentary session as the censure debate proposed by the opposition party will not be good for the nation.

Suthin further added that the Democrat Party is responsible for the chaotic political situation at the moment.

The press reported that during the press conference, Suthin expressed his anger and opposed many of the questions posed by the press, especially when asked to clarify his sincerity in supporting the government to solve the national conflict. Before the end of the conference, the press were stopped from asking questions as the PPP MP shook his finger at reporters and asked them not to speak anymore.

- Thailand Outlook (today)

[Singha Gold]

My girlfriend just got an SMS about the King stepping in and saying something prior to tomorrows (Friday's) PAD protests - she was unclear on the details. Just checked The Nation and Bangkok Post websites but they haven't been updated. Anyone see something on a Thai news channel? (And understood it?)

[thaigene2]

sriracha john, on 2008-06-19 21:44:11, said:

Wheelin' and Dealin' with the PPP... from a wannabe-like Samak...


PPP Proposes Democrats Negotiate with PAD in Return for Censure Debate
  
A People Power Party MP has urged the opposition Democrat Party to negotiate with the People's Alliance for Democracy to stop the anti-government movement, saying he will ask the government to consider accepting the censure debate motion in exchange.

People Power Party MP for Maha Sarakam, Suthin Klangsaeeng, hosted a press conference today requesting that the Democrat Party help negotiate with the PAD to have them stop the ongoing anti-government movement.

Suthin says if the Democrat Party agreed with his proposal, he will ask the PPP-government to consider accepting the Democrat's censure debate motion submitted for the extraordinary Parliamentary session next month.

Suthin says that according to his plan, he will enlist 80 names of PPP MPs to request that the government consider accepting the debate motion.

When asked for evidence that other PPP MPs supported his opinion, Suthin merely said his prestige as a politician is a guarantee.

However, he said that personally, he agreed with the PPP-led government not to extend the special Parliamentary session as the censure debate proposed by the opposition party will not be good for the nation.

Suthin further added that the Democrat Party is responsible for the chaotic political situation at the moment.

The press reported that during the press conference, Suthin expressed his anger and opposed many of the questions posed by the press, especially when asked to clarify his sincerity in supporting the government to solve the national conflict. Before the end of the conference, the press were stopped from asking questions as the PPP MP shook his finger at reporters and asked them not to speak anymore.

- Thailand Outlook (today)

Clever move by the Government. Won't work of course as the Dems, the PAD, the military cronies, all those well-healed bureaucrats living way beyond their means, syncohants, etc, etc, have one goal - to find an excuse to have Big Brother Army step in on some trumped up charge to throw out the elected government and stamp out once and for all 'populism' - you can't have populism in a country that relies on oligarchy and guanxi - it would never work. They're as scared of that as they were of communism in the 1970s.

Anyway, I'm glad to see the US and others have made it clear to Thailand that they won't ride the fence this time. If the minority elites force a coup, they'll get punished for it. But my guess is they'll do it anyway as they think they have too many priviledges to lose otherwise..so to them it's worth it.

Edited by thaigene2, 2008-06-19 22:47:25.

[h90]

thaigene2, on 2008-06-19 22:44:45, said:

sriracha john, on 2008-06-19 21:44:11, said:

Wheelin' and Dealin' with the PPP... from a wannabe-like Samak...


PPP Proposes Democrats Negotiate with PAD in Return for Censure Debate
  
A People Power Party MP has urged the opposition Democrat Party to negotiate with the People's Alliance for Democracy to stop the anti-government movement, saying he will ask the government to consider accepting the censure debate motion in exchange.

People Power Party MP for Maha Sarakam, Suthin Klangsaeeng, hosted a press conference today requesting that the Democrat Party help negotiate with the PAD to have them stop the ongoing anti-government movement.

Suthin says if the Democrat Party agreed with his proposal, he will ask the PPP-government to consider accepting the Democrat's censure debate motion submitted for the extraordinary Parliamentary session next month.

Suthin says that according to his plan, he will enlist 80 names of PPP MPs to request that the government consider accepting the debate motion.

When asked for evidence that other PPP MPs supported his opinion, Suthin merely said his prestige as a politician is a guarantee.

However, he said that personally, he agreed with the PPP-led government not to extend the special Parliamentary session as the censure debate proposed by the opposition party will not be good for the nation.

Suthin further added that the Democrat Party is responsible for the chaotic political situation at the moment.

The press reported that during the press conference, Suthin expressed his anger and opposed many of the questions posed by the press, especially when asked to clarify his sincerity in supporting the government to solve the national conflict. Before the end of the conference, the press were stopped from asking questions as the PPP MP shook his finger at reporters and asked them not to speak anymore.

- Thailand Outlook (today)

Clever move by the Government. Won't work of course as the Dems, the PAD, the military cronies, all those well-healed bureaucrats living way beyond their means, syncohants, etc, etc, have one goal - to find an excuse to have Big Brother Army step in on some trumped up charge to throw out the elected government and stamp out once and for all 'populism' - you can't have populism in a country that relies on oligarchy and guanxi - it would never work. They're as scared of that as they were of communism in the 1970s.

Anyway, I'm glad to see the US and others have made it clear to Thailand that they won't ride the fence this time. If the minority elites force a coup, they'll get punished for it. But my guess is they'll do it anyway as they think they have too many priviledges to lose otherwise..so to them it's worth it.

[thaigene2]

younghusband, on 2008-06-18 13:39:52, said:

Incidentally your view of the "negotiations" involved in the alteration of Thai borders is misleading although has a sinilar drift to the hotchpotch of lies taught about history in Thai schools.Thailand or Siam was almost always on the back foot and reacting to the wishes of (and rivalry between) the great colonial powers.

I've always thought that too..If you look at Africa (esp) and East Asia, what you see is the Colonial Powers taking on strategic nations - but "trying" to avoid direct borders with each other (happened sometimes) because that would lead to more problems. So Thailand was a good 'buffer'. Anyone seriously think if any of the powers in those days had wanted to takeThailand they would have been stopped or afraid to proceed? Didn't stop the Japanese from occupying Thailand now did it?