30 replies to this topic
Posted 2008-03-24 22:38:16
After months of struggling with my cat's pulling her hair out, multiple vetinary consultations in 2 different countries and online to Vets in the US, trials of steroids and antidepressents, I have finally come to the conclusion that it is in fact flea dermatiotis (allergy tio flea bites). A French vet in Phnom Penh showed me how to identify "flea dirt" and sure enough, despiter FrontLine, the cat still has fleas.
I have vacuumed, put carpets and cushions out in direct sunlight, sprayed them with repellents, treated the cat several times with FrontLibne and the vets gfave ivemectin. Have also treated the dog just in case, not that he ever goes anywhere near him or his house...
Still fleas. Not a whole lot, but as the cat is very allergic even the odd bite now and then is enough for her to pull out clumps of hair. She looks dreadful, with bald patches all over.
Posted 2008-03-24 22:56:54
Why have you listed this topic flea times ?
Posted 2008-03-27 20:25:17
Because I am getting awFLEA desperate!!!!!!
Seriously, no suggestions?
Can Frontline etc be given more frequently than once a month? Is there something else I can add?
Posted 2008-03-27 20:56:37
try to sprinkle flea powder on the beddings and surroundings where your cat sleeps. not sure if you can put on you cat as he might lick it off, i only used fleapowder on tiny kittens once which don't clean themselves yet. ivermec too often is not so healthy. if your cat meets other cats outside he will always be a goal for flea... but the fleapowder sprinkling should work
Posted 2008-03-31 07:41:50
Do wild cats have flea problems? No. What do wild cats eat? Raw meat. What does your cat eat? Cooked or canned meat. Read up on what happened to Pottenger's cats ...
(Extract) The healthiest cats were the ones who received raw meat and raw milk. This was the only group to produce generation after generation of healthy kittens with broad faces, adequate nasal cavities, broad dental arches, strong and correctly shaped teeth and bones, excellent tissue tone, good-quality fur with a minimum of shedding and an absence of gum disease. These cats were resistant to infections, fleas and internal parasites. They showed no sign of allergies and were gregarious, friendly and predictable in their behavior patterns. Miscarriages were rare and litters averaged five kittens, the mothers nursed without difficulty.
So, Sheryl my dear, please feed your cat its natural diet of raw meat (and raw fish) and pure water -- and while you're about it, follow the paradigm for yourself too. I refer you to my advice on the human-eczema thread. I'm trying to help but, you can lead a horse to water ...
Edited by Trevor, 2008-03-31 07:50:37.
Posted 2008-03-31 11:32:19
I feed my cat raw. Raw chicken pieces - wings, fat, bones, hearts and liver. He also gets supplements you can buy online. He has never had fleas (he stays inside, which helps) and is in excellent health. If I offer him tinned food he snubs it.
/H'd still eat a plate of cheese if you offered it, though.
As for the fleas - did you try Revolution? I find both that and frontline get rid of fleas. Maybe if you shaved poor puss temporarily?
Posted 2008-04-01 13:43:21
All the sparys and powders i have been able to find contain pyrethrins, which while safe in dogs, is lethal to cats. Thereis apparently a compung called pymethrum which is safe for cats but haven't been able to find it here??
As for you raw food folks..1)not an option because she won't take it. She will eat only dried food, mackeral flavor. I'd gladly feed her fresh mackeral, but she refuses it raw and will only occasionally accept it even cooked. She's set in her ways (8 years old0..(oh, OK, she's spoiled, too). and 2) wild cats do, indeed, get fleas.
I suspect sobriquet's luck is because his cat stays indoors. Mine is an indoor/outdoor cat and I thik it is from outside that she keeps getting re-infected.
I've tried frontline, repeatedly. She still has fleas, probablyfrom re-infection..
Posted 2008-04-03 20:07:34
Thanks. Do you know what the active ingrediant is? and where it is sold?
Is it a powder, spray or what?
Posted 2008-04-08 12:16:12
All the sparys and powders i have been able to find contain pyrethrins, which while safe in dogs, is lethal to cats. Thereis apparently a compung called pymethrum which is safe for cats but haven't been able to find it here??As for you raw food folks..1)not an option because she won't take it. She will eat only dried food, mackeral flavor. I'd gladly feed her fresh mackeral, but she refuses it raw and will only occasionally accept it even cooked. She's set in her ways (8 years old0..(oh, OK, she's spoiled, too). and 2) wild cats do, indeed, get fleas.I suspect sobriquet's luck is because his cat stays indoors. Mine is an indoor/outdoor cat and I thik it is from outside that she keeps getting re-infected.I've tried frontline, repeatedly. She still has fleas, probablyfrom re-infection..
Ever wondered why pet cats still go after birds and mice? It is because the canned garbage you feed them from supermarkets is nutritionally-inadequate.
Unfortunately you have conditioned your cat into eating worthless processed and cooked foods in exactly the same way as you have conditioned your children to eat non-raw -- thereby perpetuating the cycle of chronic ill-health in both pets and humans. Vets and doctors then follow the victims like vultures, purveying their toxic vaccines and drugs, which all fail to address the basic problem of lack of whole, raw micronutrients and enzymes in the diet.
If you just leave puss various cuts of raw meat and organs without alternatives she will soon get the message and eat them up. Wild animals have a high degree of resistance to parasites. They may be present at a low level, trying to pick off the weak, but fleas are not a significant problem in healthy, raw-food-eating individuals, as 'sobriquet' confirms above.
If you fail to make the dietary paradigm-shift required, your cat's skin problems will only become worse, and the toxic chemicals in the proprietary 'flea treatments' will kill her off all the quicker.
Edited by Trevor, 2008-04-08 12:26:32.
Posted 2008-04-08 20:47:09
Sheryl, had the same problem with my cat back in NZ, she was bald from the front legs back, treated her and the two dogs, bedding etc for fleas several times, tried hormone tablets from the vet in case of an inbalance, no luck, finally I got so sick of looking at a bald cat I got a product from the pet shop that stops them biting and chewing things and sprayed it on her with great success (checked with the vet first, she said it wouldnt hurt the cat) the fleas had pretty much gone but what was left was a bad habit! Haven't had any trouble since, her coat is great and I only treat her as often as the products state, I use Advantage for them all. As for food, all our animals have been fed on Iams/eukanuba and they have done really well, raw meat does not have all the amino acids, vitamins etc... that they need but top quality dried food does, (this is advice from my vet who I've used for many years) also helps with odors, teeth etc... just like kids, they won't starve, if that's all she has to eat she will eat it! good luck
Posted 2008-04-08 21:59:49
Thanks Babz, what is the spray called and who makes it (in case I have to order it online)?
I think our situations are the same as I have pretty much concluded that with my cat it is both flea dermatitits and psychogenic, i.e. she does have a flea allergy which is what set the whole thing off but has now developped the hair pulling as a response to other stressors as well.
I am now alternating frontline and Advantage on her (different compounds) in the hopes of getting rid of the fleas since using just one doesn;t seem to do it, I still find "flea dirt" in her hair when I check. Have done mega-cleaning of every place she sleeps in the house and bought some powders with which I will shortly treat the carpets. Alo swept up and burned loose leaves etc all around the house where she sometimes hangs out on the theory that she was re-acquriing the fleas from outside......
Posted 2008-04-09 13:39:37
Sheryl, sorry I can't remember it was a couple of years ago now, but I'll get someone at home to have a look for it, failing that I'm going back to NZ at the end of next week for a visit and will have a look myself and let you know. Yes carpets can be a problem, we have a gadget that sprays pyrethrium into the living areas every couple of mins at home, fantastic at keeping flies and bugs out of the house and also seems to help with fleas as well.
Posted 2008-04-11 23:47:59
Colloidal silver will repel fleas :
Tea tree oil is another natural remedy you can try. Let me know if you can find these in Thailand.
Add a natural raw-meat diet and moggy's skin problems will soon be over!
P.S. Humans also do great on raw meat and colloidal silver. I take both myself daily and never get sick from colds or flu even through a damp English winter.
Posted 2008-04-12 01:23:58
Dog's flatulence, flees, bad skin, allergies, cancer, etc
Many dogs are suffering from flatulence, have flees, bad skin and often die of cancer. Haven't you ever wondered why only humans and their pets get cancer. In the wild, where animals eat the way nature intended, cancer and these modern diseases are virtually extinct.
Normal treatments look a lot like the treatments for humans: Fighting the symptoms and not looking for the causes. Your dog has flatulence, then you should switch commercial food brands. If it has flees, use some poison. If his skin is bad, use some creams. If it has cancer, then let's try to kill the cancer. Seemingly, nobody ever wonders about this.
When you start to look for the real cause, it's always wise to first check the food. Let's review some facts:
A domestic dog originates from a wolf. They differ in only 1% to 2% in their gene sequences.
Wolves and domestic dogs also have identical digestive tracts.
Domestic dogs are carnivores, which means they primarily eat meat.
Commercial dog food contains loads and loads of grains.
Grains are polysaccharides and very difficult to digest for dogs and humans.
I think you are starting to get the picture here ?
The B.A.R.F. diet: Bones and Raw Food
The perfect diet to prepare for your dog, would be the food he would eat in the wild. This is primarily meat, bones, organs, eggs (all raw). Also, a wolf really likes to eat the stomach contents of its prey. This contains predigested vegetables, which are rich in vitamins and minerals. So, you can also give your dog vegetables. They seem to be very important, because the wolf knows it instinctively.
Won't my dog die because of all the bacteria and parasites or the splinters of the bones
No way: Wolves don't leave a piece of meat in the wild because it lay in the sun for several hours. Their digestive juices are stronger than those of humans and it kills virtually all bacteria and parasites. You can keep the meat and bones in your freezer and take out the parts you need the next day and put those in the refridgerator. People on the raw paleolithic diet even eat meat raw and don't get sick. The paranoia about bacteria is all in our head. Of course, after feeing your dog, it would be wise to wash your hands and not leave the bacteria on your hands for hours, because then the population increases multifolds.
Where to start
Just go to your local butcher and ask for the cheapest meat and bones they've got: Chicken backs, chicken wings, beef ribs, heart, kidney, liver tripe, etc. You'd be astonished to see how much meat you can get for such low prices. Get plenty of eggs and give them raw with the shell. At first the dog won't understand how to break the shell so help him out by breaking it while he sees it. Next time (some need longer) they will finally rediscover their wild nature. Get some vegetables once in a while: carrots, turnips, parsnip, green beans, yellow squash, zucchini, dark green lettuces, celery, a little spinach, kale, turnip greens or broccoli. You can also add some olive oil.. Fish is also allowed. Just feed entire fish (with head, organs, scales and fins) like blackfish, whiting, red fish, mullet, sardines, mackeral, etc.
NEVER EVER COOK OR BAKE THE FOOD !
It is very important that the food is raw. If you give your dog a cooked bone, it will splinter and kill the dog. Raw bones are of no problem at all. Read the BARF FAQ for lots of information.
There are several features of dogs and cats that they do not share. Cats have a looser skin so that they can turn in a predator's mouth and attack it with their claws. Cats have claws that can slice and kill while dogs' claws are mostly for traction while running. Cats have better flexabilty and eyesight than dogs, but rarely are co-operative hunters. Dogs are pack animals and cats are by and large loners.
Cats and dogs stem from a common ancestor we call Miacis that live in the Eocene age 40 million years ago. Their biological differences started appearing about 20 million years ago when a dog ancestor called Cynodictus showed up.
The reason they show so much animosity toward each other is that they are natural competitors. They eat the same prey or if one of them corners the mouse market, for instance, the other one goes hungry. The belly rules all in Nature. Both should always eat raw foods. Of course, cats need to take more care with bones.
Edited by Trevor, 2008-04-12 01:37:06.
Posted 2008-04-12 01:37:34
We use revolution on our Thai cat's and it does the job nicely. A high end western food would probably help as well. They tend to have better nutrient blends and less filler.
Posted 2008-04-12 01:45:40
duh ... then how does your vet explain why wild cats didn't go extinct millions of years ago from eating raw meat? Cats and dogs actually make their own vitamin C. Get real and wake up! The quack just wants to sell you his toxic drugs and vaccines to keep you coming back to replenish his bank account. How else do you expect him to keep his flash car in the driveway? Sending you to the butchers for your pet's raw meat isn't going to pay his bills!
Posted 2008-04-12 10:17:04
i have to fully agree, raw feeding saves a lot of misery and medicine!!
results: HAPPY, fit dogs, shiny fur, healthy skin, strong bones and teeth, clean teeth, few 'output' with no smell, no 'doggy' odor, strong puppies, excellent growth in puppies and healthy mothers, rarely dogs get 'fat', better immunity!
the difference between raw-fed and kibble-fed dogs strikes.
the same goes with cats.
Posted 2008-04-12 16:44:18
Trevor, the following is from a site discussing the BARF diet, seems the diet was started by a Vet, who has written a couple of books about it, funny that, surely not to make money out of it! Have been on a couple of sites and can find no referrence to Vitamin C being manufatctured by dogs, in fact have only found that it must be ADDED to diet daily as it is one of the water soluble ones, but yes, some vitamins and minerals can be sourced by the dog's own metabolic system. From what I read, the BARF diet seems to be designed for animals suffering from seizures. My vet is a woman, doesn't drive a flash car, and I have never had my animals to her due to illness, only the usual checkups. Everyone is entitled to their opinions, I guess we should all be chewing on a raw chicken neck.
There are beginning to be some nutritional analyses of BARF and some cases of disease or deficiency have appeared in dogs fed the raw meat diet. Two veterinarians who specialize in canine nutrition reported in the AKC Gazette(1) that some of the diets they analyzed were low or deficient in some nutrients. Letters to the editor in a subsequent Gazette(2) issue, however, disputed portions of the article.
Some veterinarians have expressed doubt about feeding bones to dogs, but BARF believers counter that fear with the assertion that cooked bones tend to splinter and cause damage, but raw bones are safe. Other veterinarians and health experts have expressed concern about bacterial contamination in raw meat diets, especially E. coli and Salmonella, and Freeman and Michel found substantial E. coli contamination in one of the diets they analyzed for their report. Both E. coli and Salmonella organisms can infect other animals and people, so even though the majority of dogs may not exhibit symptoms, they can none-the-less pass the contamination to other animals or people. Serious outbreaks of these diseases can kill or debilitate children, the elderly, and individuals with compromised immune systems.(3)
The best judge of diet is the condition of the dog. Some dogs with low energy, allergies, skin problems, and other symptoms have increased pep and stamina, shiny coats, healthy skin, and a general increase in well-being when switched to the BARF diet, but many dogs do well on premium commercial diets, especially those that are highly digestible and include fatty acid supplements. Dog owners need to weigh the advantages and disadvantages of both.
Posted 2008-04-12 22:40:00
Am I the only one who thinks the B.A.R.F. diet is aptly named?
Posted 2008-04-15 03:05:28
BARF stands for Bones And Raw Food or Biologically Appropriate Raw Food. Been watching too many re-runs of Spaceballs, have we?
By all means poison your own bodies with cooked foods, ladies, but at least feed your pets their natural diet of raw meat and fish.
Thank God you're only a moderator on Thai Visa rather than a judge in a court of law. Why is your brain so dead to the logic of raw foods and natural remedies for your pet's skin problem? Your processed diet and toxic chemical remedies haven't worked. Don't you think you owe it to your cat to try the reasonable alternatives I have outlined? Or, in common with most medical professionals, are you just too proud to admit you were wrong all along?