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Avocado Rooting And Grafting


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#1 DonaldBattles

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Posted 2008-09-01 08:50:09

I have about 40 trees that I have started from seeds which are about 2.5 years old.

Last week I met with a person who planted seeds 10 years ago and he has 4 good producing trees. He admits that he has never watered or fertilized them. I took about 40 clippings and will do both grafting and rooting of new trees. The issue of grafting vs using seeds to start seems to be split down the middle.

From observing my own trees I do know that they need full sun and not located in flooding areas. Caring for any tree will always produce better and quicker fruit.

I use about 3 tons per of avocados per year for making guocamole commercially and finding fruit is always a problem. Most of my product comes from a broker in Chiang Mai.

Don

#2 stoneman

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Posted 2008-09-01 10:13:32

Don..

I have 65 avocado trees ranging in age from 2 years to 5 years....

40 of the trees I bought from a nursery in Pak Chong and the balance I grew from seeds...I used the seed produced trees as root stock for grafting from the trees I bought from the nursery...

I admit that I do have 1 tree that I am growing from the seed...From the very start it has been a very strong looking plant and it continues to grow vigorously and so I am going to let it go for another year or 2 and see if it will bear fruit...

Stoneman

#3 meandwi

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Posted 2008-09-01 11:10:44

Don..

I have 65 avocado trees ranging in age from 2 years to 5 years....

40 of the trees I bought from a nursery in Pak Chong and the balance I grew from seeds...I used the seed produced trees as root stock for grafting from the trees I bought from the nursery...

I admit that I do have 1 tree that I am growing from the seed...From the very start it has been a very strong looking plant and it continues to grow vigorously and so I am going to let it go for another year or 2 and see if it will bear fruit...

Stoneman


Most avocado varieties do not come true from seed so they must be grafted. Cleft grafting is the preferred method of propagation. But it doesn't sound like you have any large trees. Veneer grafting is also used. Young, vigorously growing seedlings are used for rootstocks, and terminals of leafy shoots are used as the scions or inserts.. Grafting is most successful during the cooler months from November through February or March. hope this helps.

meandwi

#4 brahmburgers

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Posted 2008-09-04 13:56:00

Interesting to hear there are at least several avo growers in the C.Rai area. I too have some (60 trees) - nearly all grown from seed. Seed from good quality fruit are planted to grow to maturity - hopeful that they'll give good fruit in turn.

seed from poor quality fruit (which are common in the markets), is grown just for rootstock.

I've had no luck with getting cuttings to root, though have had a few successful grafts.

am also growing pink grapefruit (from seed) planted 8 years ago - they're small trees, and susceptible to the many problems that citrus get in this region. I tried figs from cuttings. They root readily, but after an initial growth spurt, they fizzle out - some dying, even though they get very good growing conditions. There must be a host of things which severely hinder fig growth here - maybe because there are several types of indigenous fig trees (all non-edible) which carry pathogens to the introduced types (mission and dakota).

brazil nut trees are vigorous and producing. Macadamia are also vigorous growers, but taking their time about giving nuts - though some have started flowering. A Hawaiian orchardist told me it's good to fertilize macadamia trees generously, which probably holds true for most fruit and nut trees.

I water heavily about 3 times during the dry season - seems to work well for most of the above-mentioned trees.

#5 DonaldBattles

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Posted 2008-09-05 07:21:56

[quote name='stoneman' date='2008-09-01 10:13:32' post='2183473']
Don..

With 65 trees you should do OK. I am trying to buy as many avocados in Chiang Rai as I can to produce guacomole for commercial sale.

You mention that you use seeds to produce root stock. Can you give me a little more information on how you do this.

I have read that there are over 500 different varieties of avocados. If we work togethere there could be some good money involved.

Thanks.

Don

#6 DonaldBattles

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Posted 2008-09-05 07:29:09

IF your trees are producing I am interested in purchasing fruit as I need a lot for guacamole production.

Your Brazil nut trees sound interesting, are they producing yet.

Best wishes.

Don

#7 brahmburgers

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Posted 2008-09-06 20:37:38

Hi Don, my avo trees are not yet producing. This year, a few started flowering for the first time, but were spread apart and didn't cross polinate to produce as well as hoped. Each successive year should bring better results, so I'm hopefull next year will be decent in that regard. Avos produce best when different types pollinate each other - so I've planted them accordingly. I may not get a decent crop for another 2 or three years. I've also been told to expect initial fruit from trees to be inferior - as they should produce better quality in successive years. They sure grow strong though, some trees are 25 feet wide with 10 inch trunks in just seven years.

Although Brazil trees also grow strong, are easy to propagate (from seed and from rooted cuttings), and produce nuts readily - however, the nut sizes are small. Am hopefull that the bigger the trees get, the bigger the nuts they'll produce. Shelled Brazil nuts in shops in the States are about the size of the last 2 digits of a person's pinkie. Whereas the ones I get are a bit larger than a garbanzo bean. The pods are softball sized and each pod has about 13 nuts. If someone knows of a top quality brazil nut tree, I'd like to get cuttings from it and try grafting on to my existing trees.

Some trees that should enjoy Chiang Rai climate: olives, kiwis (vines), - am looking for a supply.

I got some vanilla vines recently and they're growing strong. I tried grapes but had no luck witht he type I was given. Thornless blackberries grow rather well here, but have yielded no decent fruit in the mere two years I've been propagating them.

#8 DonaldBattles

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Posted 2008-09-07 09:13:46

I think that this is a long term situation. If your trees are this big after 7 years I believe that within the next 3 years they should produce good. You might want to consider pollitation by hand even though it is difficult.

Good care of the trees will cause them to produce faster and more.

As you know, part of my business in Chiang Rai is jalapeno and habanara peppers. It has been a struggle with farmers who don't have much interest in taking care of their crops. This year I plan to lease land it do it with my own staff and see what develops.

Let me know if you learn anymore about the avocados.

Thanks.

Don

#9 stoneman

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Posted 2008-09-07 09:33:09

I think that this is a long term situation. If your trees are this big after 7 years I believe that within the next 3 years they should produce good. You might want to consider pollitation by hand even though it is difficult.

Good care of the trees will cause them to produce faster and more.

As you know, part of my business in Chiang Rai is jalapeno and habanara peppers. It has been a struggle with farmers who don't have much interest in taking care of their crops. This year I plan to lease land it do it with my own staff and see what develops.

Let me know if you learn anymore about the avocados.

Thanks.

Don



Don..Hand pollination of a 30 ft tree is a little impractical...According to all the sources I have read, the best way is with bee hives...As a matter of fact, the groves around San Diego hire professional bee keepers to transport the hives to the groves for pollination...When you are initially setting up the grove, you map out space for bee hives. I remember a thread here on ThaiVisa about bee hives being for sale , I believe it was down around Kohn Kaen...I am going to try it this fall..

Stoneman

#10 brahmburgers

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Posted 2008-09-07 19:51:20

Don..Hand pollination of a 30 ft tree is a little impractical...According to all the sources I have read, the best way is with bee hives...As a matter of fact, the groves around San Diego hire professional bee keepers to transport the hives to the groves for pollination...When you are initially setting up the grove, you map out space for bee hives. I remember a thread here on ThaiVisa about bee hives being for sale , I believe it was down around Kohn Kaen...I am going to try it this fall..

Stoneman


a few words about bees and other insects: good point, I'll keep a look out for hives - to get a few set up.

As for wild bees, there are a few types: There are the little ones, actually wasps, who make fan shaped paper hives about a foot vertical by half foot wide by 3/4 inch. Locals destroy them. I think it's for one or more of the following reasons: they're afraid of getting bitten, they think there's honey (there's not), or grubs (there are), or they destroy them for the heck of it, just like they hack in to big trees with their machetes while walking by. I tell locals to leave them alone, but they just smirk and do what they want (the people, not the bees).

Then there are the gnarly wasps as big as the tip of man's finger - with yellowish-orange spot. I tend to want to destroy them, but locals want to keep them, as they can harvest the pupae when the hive is big. ....same for orange ants which stitch leaves together with their white threads. The oarnge ants are rather big and give a pesky bite - especially after they take over a tree - down to the tip of every leaf and twig. They might do some pollination also, but I don't want hordes of biting ants for any reason - so I destroy their nests when I find them.

Even without bees, there might be enough of other insects, hopefully benign types, to do sufficient pollination - plus there's the wind.

#11 wdrk7

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Posted 2008-11-08 20:55:05

IF your trees are producing I am interested in purchasing fruit as I need a lot for guacamole production.

Your Brazil nut trees sound interesting, are they producing yet.

Best wishes.

Don



Dear Don ,

I do have some Avocado trees producing right now , let me know if you are interested in buying my fruits .

Best Regards ,

Kong

#12 DonaldBattles

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Posted 2008-11-09 09:24:37

Dear Don ,

I do have some Avocado trees producing right now , let me know if you are interested in buying my fruits .

Best Regards ,

Kong
[/quote]

Kong:

I am in Chiang Rai and would be interested in purchasing Avocados from you. I just bought 75 kg from Chiang Mai but can use more. I paid 30B/kg for these.

I did the grafting on my trees this year and they seem to be holding.

Call me at 081 894 6401 to make arrangements.

#13 wdrk7

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Posted 2008-11-11 23:14:09

Dear Don ,

Will contact you when i get back to CR .


Regards ,

Kong

#14 avocados

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Posted 2009-02-15 10:08:55

Need help. I am looking to buy around 3000-6000 of avocados seeds. I will grow and graft them later. Does anyone know where I can source the seeds in large quantity in Thailand, beside from Pak Chong? Thanks.

#15 DonaldBattles

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Posted 2009-02-16 07:38:01

I have a lot of avocado seeds that I have saved. Will use some and can sell the others. Try to call me on Saturday Feb. 21 when I will be in Doi Hang. Call Don at 081 894 6401.

I process a lot of avocados weekly for commercial sale in Bangkok.

#16 jaideeguy

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Posted 2009-02-17 07:32:41

The university of Hawaii, [my university] has been working with tropical avocado cultivars for decades and have come up with a few winners....my favorite is the 'Sharwil' and have wanted to graft them over here on my 4 pet avocado trees just to have future grafting stock. I'm sure they will do well here as they were developed for tropical conditions.


'Sharwil' avocados have small seeds and greenish-yellow flesh with a rich, nutty flavor. In Hawaii, many consider 'Sharwil' to be superior to California cultivars and believe it should be marketed as a gourmet item. 'Sharwil' has green skin when ripe, which is a problem where consumers rely on black skin as a sign of ripeness. It is the only Hawaii avocado authorized for shipment to Alaska and the US mainland in compliance with USDA/Animal and Plant Health Inspection Service (APHIS) requirements. Avocados destined for these markets are required to be packed in a fruit fly-proof, APHIS-approved and -inspected packinghouse.


Is anyone here working with this cultivar?? and would be willing to share grafting stock??

#17 Swelters

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Posted 2009-03-16 12:58:25

The university of Hawaii, [my university] has been working with tropical avocado cultivars for decades and have come up with a few winners....my favorite is the 'Sharwil' and have wanted to graft them over here on my 4 pet avocado trees just to have future grafting stock. I'm sure they will do well here as they were developed for tropical conditions.


'Sharwil' avocados have small seeds and greenish-yellow flesh with a rich, nutty flavor. In Hawaii, many consider 'Sharwil' to be superior to California cultivars and believe it should be marketed as a gourmet item. 'Sharwil' has green skin when ripe, which is a problem where consumers rely on black skin as a sign of ripeness. It is the only Hawaii avocado authorized for shipment to Alaska and the US mainland in compliance with USDA/Animal and Plant Health Inspection Service (APHIS) requirements. Avocados destined for these markets are required to be packed in a fruit fly-proof, APHIS-approved and -inspected packinghouse.


Is anyone here working with this cultivar?? and would be willing to share grafting stock??


We like the avos we buy when available (not often) at Villa here in BKK at about 25 baht each, they are pale green smooth skin (not Haas like the imports at 60-110 baht). I'm told they come from Pak Chong. This was mentioned in a post here, anyone know where the nursery is in Pak Chong? We have land, sandy hillside soil and good water at about elevation 250 meters in the foothills south of Pak Tong Chai Korat and would like to try to grow avos, any tips or basic references appreciated. My wife is a farmer but I don't know if she knows about grafting and such.

Swelters

#18 silby8cookies

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Posted 2009-04-14 16:08:31

Stoneman and Don,

Any idea of the contacts for the nursery in Pak Chong where you bought the seedlings. My wife and I would like to plant 2-3 trees in property we have in Chonburi and in Bangkok both and are looking for a place to buy the trees.

Thanks, John


I have about 40 trees that I have started from seeds which are about 2.5 years old.

Last week I met with a person who planted seeds 10 years ago and he has 4 good producing trees. He admits that he has never watered or fertilized them. I took about 40 clippings and will do both grafting and rooting of new trees. The issue of grafting vs using seeds to start seems to be split down the middle.

From observing my own trees I do know that they need full sun and not located in flooding areas. Caring for any tree will always produce better and quicker fruit.

I use about 3 tons per of avocados per year for making guocamole commercially and finding fruit is always a problem. Most of my product comes from a broker in Chiang Mai.

Don



#19 avocados

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Posted 2009-11-17 09:16:56

any one has avocados seeds for sales? am looking for seeds in large quantity. 0892090666

#20 brahmburgers

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Posted 2009-11-26 22:02:42

Still, nearly no avos from my trees this time around, ....shucks.

However, they're growing hardy, some with trunks a foot wide, and branches spreading nearly 30 feet wide.

A couple different sources told me that harming the trunk 'shocks' the tree in to producing. One recommended driving iron spikes in sideways - yikes!

One of 10 macadamia trees gave nuts this year - first one to do so.

Brazil noi trees (my name, because they're not the big type seen in stores) - are producing nicely. Went out with a couple kids and picked a bunch, took 'em home to release the nuts (easy to do, especially when the pods dry). Then my gal gave them all away to her step mom without even telling me beforehand. Gadzeus, it's hard to reap the benefits of one's labors sometimes.

#21 jaideeguy

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Posted 2009-11-27 06:44:55

Brahm.....You mis read my post.....I was just asking if anyone was working with the sharwell cultivar from Hawaii and would like to find some for my own use on the 4 or 5 avo trees that I have. Sharwell produces great tasting fruit.....IMHO, much better than hass and it is adaptable to tropical conditions. Still looking and if anyone finds them, please post.

I have seen an occasional avo in Makro that resembles sharwell. largish fruit, lite green smooth skin with small seed and creamy flavor.

#22 Limbo

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Posted 2010-03-29 11:09:48

I think something is wrong with the numbering of the avocado topics.
Could this be the first avocado topic of Don Battles?
I think the second was opened by a certain Don Battles.
Even the third was opened by somebody with the name Don Battles,
but (relief, relief!) the fourth one was Klikster's, because I started to think
that 'Don Battles' is a brand name for a certain kind of avocado.
So now Klikster's avocado topic is numbered three, but according to my arithmetics
it should be number four.

Limbo :)





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