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[aussiejosh]

Yesterday a friend of mine had a run in with the park cops in Queens park, or the security there I am not sure if they are actually police. Basically he was walking past queens park after leaving friends of mine at Emporium and he flicked his cigarette butt onto the ground while walking and just left it there (littering), anyway the security guard yelled at him and he turned to respond and straight away they just said you are going to prison, you have broken the law unless you can pay a fine now of 1000 baht...
He didn't have any money on him at the time (well very little 100 baht or so to get home) and had only the option of just saying no i cant pay you that amount. They kept threatening to arrest him and claiming they were about to take him to the police station so he started calling me and my other friends... Basically we got a Thai friend of ours to tell the police officer to issue a fine or to just let him go as he hadn't done anything that illegal. The police officer refused and made some weak attempt of looking official actually taking his finger prints there in the park security booth and getting him to write his name on the same random piece of paper they had gotten him to put his finger prints on. He just gave a completely random name and left, they told him to come back today at 11 am and pay them their fine or they would send this piece of paper to the embassy, to which I just laughed after what he explained to me with the random paper they found and got him to record details on.

Just sharing with you guys, and wondering if anyone had a similar experience with park security of all things. Do they even have Jurisdiction to do that not to mention authority outside their park grounds (which he was merely walking past not in)?

Edited by aussiejosh, 2009-02-12 11:09:22.

[aussiejosh]

Oh I forgot to mention in the 15 minutes they were trying to get money from him, another foreigner came by (total tourist no idea about Thailand) and according to him his crime was stepping his cigarette bud out in the park. Ok, you can't smoke in the park so thats fair enough to grab him, but he actually paid 1500 baht to them straight away as they threatened again to take him to prison.

What is up with these park cops?

[NewLifeNY]

aussiejosh, on 2009-02-12 11:11:23, said:

Oh I forgot to mention in the 15 minutes they were trying to get money from him, another foreigner came by (total tourist no idea about Thailand) and according to him his crime was stepping his cigarette bud out in the park. Ok, you can't smoke in the park so thats fair enough to grab him, but he actually paid 1500 baht to them straight away as they threatened again to take him to prison.

What is up with these park cops?

I think the "park security" are just people who tried out for the policeman job but just didnt cut it, but they still have the "police" mentality of "pay me or i am taking you to jail" etc. I was playing basketball at lumpini park, my friends and i left our bags (backpacks) on the side of the court, suddenly this angry little "park officer" woman comes screaming and blowing her wistle telling us to move the bags NOW or else we are going to pay (her) a fine. My friend asked her "why?" she said, that " children can trip and fall" on these bags..I told her in Thai that she was crazy and that if she wanted to make a complaint then to pls come back with the "real police", she said she would but never returned.....they just have nothing better to do but to try to take money from farang, if u let them.

[Soutpeel]

Did the park security have a whistle ???...   

They are rent-a-cops....tell them to f*kc off and come back with a "real" policeman

[aussiejosh]

Yeah, its what he should have done and knows now but its a tourist trap it seems.

Love that part about the woman park officer in Lumpini, made me giggle her explanation.

[RakJungTorlae]

The green badge landmark ranger police. I hate them so much, but unfortunate they do have the authority to arrest and fine in there assigned areas. But agreed there so gay. Just kick them in the balls and run next time.

[dave111223]

I know there are actually fairly hefty penalties for littering cigarette butts.  And it's not uncommon for (real) police to "bust" people and collect a bribe, instead of the heavy official fine.  The entrance to the weekend market seems to be one of their favorite spots to pick up tourists flicking their cigarettes.

However this is besides the point anyways as the security guard would likely not have any more authority than a citizens arrest in this case.  Which he would never actually do, seeing as from what i've heard citizens arrests in Thailand often end up with the arrester getting sued, as there would be no witnesses to prove that the guy had actually flicked a cigarette, but there would be witnesses to see the guard arresting the guy (causing "physical and emotional damage").

The park security are just looking for an opportunity to earn some extra money.  I would hazard a guess that they have no more authority to write you a ticket for littering outside the park than to go out in traffic and give you a speeding ticket.

Edited by dave111223, 2009-02-12 11:59:14.

[Soutpeel]

aussiejosh, on 2009-02-12 11:49:30, said:

Yeah, its what he should have done and knows now but its a tourist trap it seems.

Love that part about the woman park officer in Lumpini, made me giggle her explanation.

The one that always tickles me when It comes to Thai security is the walk through metal detectors...A few years ago the office building we are in proudly had a walk through metal detectors installed on the ground floor in the middle of a corridor, but you could walk down the corridor on one side and avoid walking through the detector...A collegue, rather tongue in cheek asked the security man if he wanted us to walk thorugh the metal detector...answer..."Up to You"...   

[namoo]

Notorious for doing that OUTSIDE queens park - been happening there for years.

A polite oh sorry pick up the offending article put it in the bin and WALK and just keeping walking they have no right to detain, touch or harass you if you are outside the park

However no sympathy for your friend as he should show some respect and dispose of it in a proper manner anyway. No manners!

Edited by namoo, 2009-02-12 12:19:28.

[tartempion]

Well it's illegal indeed to throw a cig but anywhere on the ground in Thailand and a 1k fine sounds reasoneable (I rememebr the max fine to be 2k?)
So why should a park guard NOT be entitled to collect a fine on his territory? Certainly should be part of his job.  

There was a cop watching people walk on the passage way towards BTS National Stadium, MBK/Tokyu, he would not miss anyone throwing a but.
Could you find a better but throwing spot in Bangkok???
Surely a money making thing, he had his monthly quota to reach from which he collects his share, his boss poaching the max.

[RakJungTorlae]

namoo, on 2009-02-12 12:18:24, said:

Notorious for doing that OUTSIDE queens park - been happening there for years.

A polite oh sorry pick up the offending article put it in the bin and WALK and just keeping walking they have no right to detain, touch or harass you if you are outside the park

However no sympathy for your friend as he should show some respect and dispose of it in a proper manner anyway. No manners!

Nice 1^st post.

I do have many burns on my hands due to no where to flick the buds and cops are always around. Not enough bins in this city.

[sriracha john]

aussiejosh, on 2009-02-12 11:08:45, said:

Yesterday a friend of mine had a run in with the park cops in Queens park

The police officer refused and made some weak attempt of looking official actually taking his finger prints there in the park security booth and getting him to write his name on the same random piece of paper they had gotten him to put his finger prints on. He just gave a completely random name and left

I was walking in the park yesterday myself and now I understand what this paper was all about that I retrieved after I noticed it falling out of a policeman's pocket.....

















Disclaimer: I'm kidding in case anyone isn't sure.

[tod-daniels]

Sadly, if you would look closely at them and at the green emblem on their sleeve, you would see they are "Grung-thep Te-sa-gid" (กรุงเทพฯ เทศกิจ), or municipal code enforcers for the Bangkok metropolitan area.  They are usually stationed in tourist heavy areas and actually have a small booth by my house which is manned by 3 or 4 all day.  

They routinely apprehend foreigners for littering while ignoring any thai who litters.  This may seem oxymoronic on the surface, but seeing as this is "thai-land"; thais can litter in their country, while foreigners are held to a different standard.  They even have a laminated A4 piece of paper which states the penalty and is printed in atrocious thai-engrish.  My advice; don't look for logic where there is none, and don't litter in a country which is not yours.

They are all bark and no bite.  In walking past the booth near my house in over 4 years, I have NEVER EVER seen a person hauled off to jail, mainly because they are CODE inspectors, not police (evidenced by the fact they don't carry guns).  They are just trying to do their job, and their job is to single out foreigners stupid enough to litter in this country and make them pay a fine.  Suck it up.

[slackula]

Same thing happened to me a few years ago and I only had a couple of hundred Baht on me.

After a bit of discussion they told me to pick up litter for 20 minutes, which I did, and then they let me go on my way with a cheery smile and a wave.

[dave111223]

tartempion, on 2009-02-12 12:20:52, said:

So why should a park guard NOT be entitled to collect a fine on his territory? Certainly should be part of his job.

The key is that it's not his territory, if you read the OP the incident happened outside the park.

If it had happened inside the park then you could be correct.

Edited by dave111223, 2009-02-12 12:49:05.

[aussiejosh]

IDK why people are saying things like "suck it up." and "don't litter in someone else's country" (quick replying at work so no direct quoting soz)... I didn't litter, it was my friend who isn't going to read your posts so its irrelevant. Myself I can't imagine trying to justify a 1000 or 2000 baht fine in Thailand for a single cigarette butt seeing as that would be far to much for the average Thai.

Oh, and guards shouldn't be collecting it themselves, thats retarded and not how a legal system works.

[cymruambyth1]

Outside Bully's Pub on Sukhumvit Road near the Marriott is another favoured haunt of these individuals.

[polecat]

aussiejosh, on 2009-02-12 13:29:48, said:

Oh, and guards shouldn't be collecting it themselves, thats retarded and not how a legal system works.

Welcome to Thailand

[neverdie]

aussiejosh, on 2009-02-12 13:29:48, said:

IDK why people are saying things like "suck it up." and "don't litter in someone else's country" (quick replying at work so no direct quoting soz)... I didn't litter, it was my friend who isn't going to read your posts so its irrelevant. Myself I can't imagine trying to justify a 1000 or 2000 baht fine in Thailand for a single cigarette butt seeing as that would be far to much for the average Thai.

Oh, and guards shouldn't be collecting it themselves, thats retarded and not how a legal system works.

Perhaps in all your wisdom and experience you might like to educate the rest of us on how things do work then. Perhaps you should re-read tod-daniels post & reconsider what he is actually saying.

Edited by neverdie, 2009-02-12 17:07:05.

[aussiejosh]

There how things are and how things work. There is a difference.
Its happening but the system thus does not work, in fact your going around the actual system.

[JetsetBkk]

tod-daniels, on 2009-02-12 12:25:10, said:

... They are just trying to do their job, and their job is to single out foreigners stupid enough to litter in this country and make them pay a fine.  Suck it up.

namoo, on 2009-02-12 12:18:24, said:

...However no sympathy for your friend as he should show some respect and dispose of it in a proper manner anyway. No manners!

[tw25rw]

RakJungTorlae, on 2009-02-12 05:21:14, said:

namoo, on 2009-02-12 12:18:24, said:

Notorious for doing that OUTSIDE queens park - been happening there for years.

A polite oh sorry pick up the offending article put it in the bin and WALK and just keeping walking they have no right to detain, touch or harass you if you are outside the park

However no sympathy for your friend as he should show some respect and dispose of it in a proper manner anyway. No manners!

Nice 1^st post.

I do have many burns on my hands due to no where to flick the buds and cops are always around. Not enough bins in this city.

Smokers deserve everything they get and more.

[robblok]

Thais are the worst litterers around. I have never seen a country filled with more garbage. When i go fishing at fishing parks its a mess. They don't clean it up or place enough litter bins. There should be more litter bins around in Thailand it might help a bit. But i agree that you should not litter but everyone should be treated the same (i know will never happen).

[Heng]

Soutpeel, on 2009-02-12 12:00:21, said:

aussiejosh, on 2009-02-12 11:49:30, said:

Yeah, its what he should have done and knows now but its a tourist trap it seems.

Love that part about the woman park officer in Lumpini, made me giggle her explanation.

The one that always tickles me when It comes to Thai security is the walk through metal detectors...A few years ago the office building we are in proudly had a walk through metal detectors installed on the ground floor in the middle of a corridor, but you could walk down the corridor on one side and avoid walking through the detector...A collegue, rather tongue in cheek asked the security man if he wanted us to walk thorugh the metal detector...answer..."Up to You"...   

The metal detectors are basically just checkpoints where they can frisk southerners or anyone else who looks/sounds suspicious.  (substitute "Arab/Middle Eastern Looking" for the US)  It'd be impractical to stop and search everyone who has a bunch of keys, a steel watch, etc. because that's going to be a thousand+ people per checkpoint that you're have to stop.

[JetsetBkk]

robblok, on 2009-02-13 23:15:35, said:

...There should be more litter bins around in Thailand it might help a bit...

Made of what?

Metal - they'd be stolen and sold as scrap or converted into a zillion different saleable items (just like the drain covers in my soi)
Plastic - ditto.
Wood - good for the cold season.
Concrete - possibly... but it might have to be bolted down.
Old rubber tyre turned inside out - possible...