Posted 2009-07-04 04:51:38
 galowgala, on 2009-07-03 08:00:12, said:
I got married about 1 and a half years ago to a Thai lady, My house is owned by my company,
She noticed on my blue book for my house that the name in it was the German builders Thai wife's name was in the blue book, so she went to the Amphur office to change it for me, but unbeknown to me as i was signing the documents in Thai.
she was actually putting the house book in here name and not my company as i thought. now she has the house in her name she has made all efforts to split us up and tells me now that the house is hers and i cant have it back. I went to a Thai lawyer and he tells me that the chanute is still my company's name so i own the land but she owns the building now.
The lawyer tells me i can knock the house down as her house is on my company's land, that really is not going to help me as i need to sell it to try and retrieve some of the money she has creamed out of me, with all her stories, i don't want to bore you with all them stories and lies. but basically what can i do, if anything to get my house back, please can i have constructive and correct info, as i really don't need to be told what a " Stupid Farang " I am. Im distressed enough as it is.
Seems like your lawyer has given you wrong info. The land and the house belongs to the co ltd, nomatter who is registered living in it in tabien baan.
Managing director of the co ltd can go to Amphur and get a new Tabien baan (costs 20 baht) without any resident registered, or have her deleted from existing Tabien baan. Then your ex wife does not have access to the property any more, unless you let her in.
Posted 2009-07-04 05:07:40
Vang2x, on 2009-07-03 22:51:04, said: galowgala, on 2009-07-03 08:00:12, said: I got married about 1 and a half years ago to a Thai lady, My house is owned by my company,
She noticed on my blue book for my house that the name in it was the German builders Thai wife's name was in the blue book, so she went to the Amphur office to change it for me, but unbeknown to me as i was signing the documents in Thai.
she was actually putting the house book in here name and not my company as i thought. now she has the house in her name she has made all efforts to split us up and tells me now that the house is hers and i cant have it back. I went to a Thai lawyer and he tells me that the chanute is still my company's name so i own the land but she owns the building now.
The lawyer tells me i can knock the house down as her house is on my company's land, that really is not going to help me as i need to sell it to try and retrieve some of the money she has creamed out of me, with all her stories, i don't want to bore you with all them stories and lies. but basically what can i do, if anything to get my house back, please can i have constructive and correct info, as i really don't need to be told what a " Stupid Farang " I am. Im distressed enough as it is.
I can't really digest how cruel some people are. That is ABUSE,CHEATING,STEALING, SWINDLING and still a CRIME. The problem is there's no LAW that support such inhumane act. I'm very "impressed" as it is such the "safest" way to do ROBBERY without being LIABLE to it, yes, MARRIAGE. Can you sue your marital partner anyway regarding that matter? Or has anyone asked for justice to those who had done the crime to them? I know...the answer is __________(just blank.) It seems like it's a "system" planned attainable in years, luring the prey until the time is right to trap them! Better than a business plan! I wouldn't say it's a perfect crime but definitely a WAY of INCOME at the expense of others. Instead of being GRATEFUL for what the other person has offered to them which we are all aware one could HARDLY HAVE and ENJOY, look what they give back? I should say I have more respect for those who commit petty crimes than these kinds of felonious creatures- just no shame!
It's definitely beyond imagination that people who are doing this can still walk with their heads up and enjoying the things which they don't really OWN. I'm not sure if I can still speak of the word GUILT, I doubt if there is.
I'm sorry to hear about your situation. We are all prone to errors, you may be outsmarted by someone you never thought had the capabilities to do such a thing to you. You just trusted her, that's all. Moreover, you are not alone who has the experience. But it doesn't mean that you don't have to do anything about it. If you just sit right there then it's as pointless for you to complain or criticize any system or anything else (in case you'd think of this) when you can't defend your own self. These crimes are continously happening, getting worse and more practiced as of course, they're very effective. Maybe because no victim hadn't really done something about this.
Good luck and hope that'd be cleared up soon.
On the other hand,it's in the hard way but still this serves a lesson. Then perhaps those who wish to marry can consider PRE NUPTIAL AGREEMENT to protect themeselves. Better be safe than sorry so to speak.
very interesting reading and all very true, thank you for your insight and i totally agree with all you have said and by the way i also had a prenuptual agreement, but this being Thailand i don't trust that now.
Posted 2009-07-04 07:39:14
[quote name='galowgala' date='2009-07-03 08:00:12' post='2846791']
I got married about 1 and a half years ago to a Thai lady, My house is owned by my company,
She noticed on my blue book for my house that the name in it was the German builders Thai wife's name was in the blue book, so she went to the Amphur office to change it for me, but unbeknown to me as i was signing the documents in Thai.
she was actually putting the house book in here name and not my company as i thought. now she has the house in her name she has made all efforts to split us up and tells me now that the house is hers and i cant have it back. I went to a Thai lawyer and he tells me that the chanute is still my company's name so i own the land but she owns the building now.
The lawyer tells me i can knock the house down as her house is on my company's land, that really is not going to help me as i need to sell it to try and retrieve some of the money she has creamed out of me, with all her stories, i don't want to bore you with all them stories and lies. but basically what can i do, if anything to get my house back, please can i have constructive and correct info, as i really don't need to be told what a " Stupid Farang " I am. Im distressed enough as it is.
----------------------------
Dont think too much about that lawyer.. I just checked with my best friends wife (Isaan), and she clearly can confirm what other guys had said ealier here.
Blue book is just a confirmation of what THAI people living in the house, the Yellow book tells only what FALANG lives in the house And the Chanote is the big paper. This one proves ownership.
Good luck, and I am sad that your marriage has gone bad.
Glegolo
Posted 2009-07-04 08:53:07
To those of you that gave simple easy to follow answers, thank you. I am one of those people planning on purchasing something at some point down the road, and this thread has been helpful. I know that there are others like me reading and following closely.
Posted 2009-07-04 09:13:25
to the OP.
IMO, Many times a Thai spouse thinks they know how the law works, but they really do not.
Your company owns the land. Unless you signed a lease agreement leasing the home to her in those papers you spoke of, she has no rights at all.
The blue book as many have stated in this thread is just the tabian baan and means little in the scheme of things.
If your bought the house prior to your marriage to her, this will also strong point in the divorce in relation to dividing of assets. (just an point that has not been mentioned thus far).
In my limited experience, I think you will be fine. Karma catches up on us all.
I wish you well Sir.
Let us all know how your get on.
Edited by Detox, 2009-07-04 09:14:11.
Posted 2009-07-04 09:59:45
Detox, on 2009-07-04 10:13:25, said: The blue book as many have stated in this thread is just the tabian baan and means little in the scheme of things.
True
Should still get here deleted from Tabien baan or have a new tabien baan issued. As long as she is registered resident in the house, the police will if have problem assume she has the right to live there.
Previously i said its done in Amphur. Its not. Its in Tessabaan. And its still 20 baht 
Posted 2009-07-04 12:38:13
What's the latest mate?
Is your home safe?
Did you check if the chanote is still in your company name?
Posted 2009-07-04 12:53:20
Carib, on 2009-07-03 23:29:08, said: Again, Blue book has nothing to do with ownership of the house. Neither does a building permit and the name which is on it. It is a permit to BUILD. If selling a house would it always belong to the builder?? Right !
The house belongs to the registered builder, the person whose name is on the building permit, unless and until there is a subsequent sales agreement registered at the land office. A sales agreement has to be registered at the land office, before there can be a new owner of the house. A house can be owned separate from the land (chanote), provided the alleged owner has documents proving it. There is no such thing as a title document for a house, you either built the house (building permit) or the previous owner sold it to you (sales agreement).
Posted 2009-07-04 14:51:21
.........or the builder built it for you (construction contract)
Hence my previous post questioning whether the OP's company can easily establish ownership of the house to a prospective buyer (he's in a rush to sell).
If not will take at least more than 30 days and as he doesn't know what documents he signed he may have granted wife a 3 year lease.
Posted 2009-07-04 15:49:08
InterestedObserver, on 2009-07-04 12:53:20, said: Carib, on 2009-07-03 23:29:08, said: Again, Blue book has nothing to do with ownership of the house. Neither does a building permit and the name which is on it. It is a permit to BUILD. If selling a house would it always belong to the builder?? Right !
The house belongs to the registered builder, the person whose name is on the building permit, unless and until there is a subsequent sales agreement registered at the land office. A sales agreement has to be registered at the land office, before there can be a new owner of the house. A house can be owned separate from the land (chanote), provided the alleged owner has documents proving it. There is no such thing as a title document for a house, you either built the house (building permit) or the previous owner sold it to you (sales agreement).
100% true, the Blue Book has nothing to do with the ownership of the house.
The Building Permit is the evidence of house ownership for the land department if requested to transfer ownership of house to a third party. If the building permit was applied on behalf of another person, such should have signed a Power of Attorney and showing such certified by Oar.Por.Tor or Tesabaan is evidence of different ownership. Trasnfer of building permit is possible as long the building permit is valid and not having issued the house register yet. And such can be in the name of the foreigner if the foreigner has an address where to send notice to (as of decision by the officer).
Ownership of house can be different form land ownership and either Building Permit ore by trasnfer of ownership by official registration of Purchase/Sales agreement for construction issued by the land department
So again I agree with above.
Posted 2009-07-04 16:58:11
I think all the previous posters are right Galowgala about the BLUE BOOK.
But as one poster recently indicated too: why don't you try going down to the 'Amphur', preferably with your lawyer, and try to get her name removed from the blue book as she no longer lives there. I don't quite know the in's and out's of this, but it's worth a try and distances her further from any monetary challenge she may be able to launch.
Won't take you long and the answer will be yes or no ..try it, and good luck.
Posted 2009-07-04 17:02:38
thaiwanderer, on 2009-07-04 14:51:21, said: .........or the builder built it for you (construction contract)
Hence my previous post questioning whether the OP's company can easily establish ownership of the house to a prospective buyer (he's in a rush to sell).
If not will take at least more than 30 days and as he doesn't know what documents he signed he may have granted wife a 3 year lease.
If you are having a house built for yourself, make sure that you get your name on the building permit. A construction contract between you and the builder is exactly that, it won't prove ownership in the future. Only the building permit or a sales agreement will do that. If the land is owned by a company, then you should secure a 30 year lease and then get the building permit in your name.
Posted 2009-07-04 17:11:49
You should have a yellow 'tabien ban' - house registration. Not a 'blue book'
I've had a yellow book for every house that I've rented. If your company bought the land then I guess that means the tabien ban has to be a Thai blue one?
I find it really hard to understand that your wife is trying to play you for the property. Most relationships between Thais and Farangs are built upon trust and love. 
Edited by Geekfreaklover, 2009-07-04 17:14:46.
Posted 2009-07-04 19:04:46
Posted 2009-07-04 20:16:30
galowgala, on 2009-07-03 08:00:12, said: I got married about 1 and a half years ago to a Thai lady, My house is owned by my company,
She noticed on my blue book for my house that the name in it was the German builders Thai wife's name was in the blue book, so she went to the Amphur office to change it for me, but unbeknown to me as i was signing the documents in Thai.
she was actually putting the house book in here name and not my company as i thought. now she has the house in her name she has made all efforts to split us up and tells me now that the house is hers and i cant have it back. I went to a Thai lawyer and he tells me that the chanute is still my company's name so i own the land but she owns the building now.
The lawyer tells me i can knock the house down as her house is on my company's land, that really is not going to help me as i need to sell it to try and retrieve some of the money she has creamed out of me, with all her stories, i don't want to bore you with all them stories and lies. but basically what can i do, if anything to get my house back, please can i have constructive and correct info, as i really don't need to be told what a " Stupid Farang " I am. Im distressed enough as it is.
just to validate your info and so my understanding on your post, do you mean you and your wife are splitting this time perhaps getting a divorce soon and then she told you that you can't have the house back as she owns it already?
Posted 2009-07-04 20:16:32
Proof of ownership should not be confused with the house registration document (Ta Bian Baan), the blue book (Thor Ror 14) or the yellow book for foreigners (Thor Ror 13). The books, blue or yellow, is only a register of the house and its occupants at the district amphur.
The house registration book is under Thai law an official document identifying the house. It gives the full address of the house at the book's first page and the name of the owner in the house book, as well as all of the all house occupants on the preceding pages. However, for a foreigner a yellow book will be issued. The name of the owner is usually written on the first page.
If the OP and his wife have registered their marriage in Thailand both spouses own the house on equal basis as the house, not the land, as the house is regarded as Sin Somros under the Civil & Commercial Code, sections 1465 - 1493, irrespectively of who's name it is on the document; this provided the purchase of the property was made during marriage. Therefore, the OP's fear may be of academical interests only.
Posted 2009-07-05 00:00:55
stgrhe, on 2009-07-04 20:16:32, said: If the OP and his wife have registered their marriage in Thailand both spouses own the house on equal basis as the house, not the land, as the house is regarded as Sin Somros under the Civil & Commercial Code, sections 1465 - 1493, irrespectively of who's name it is on the document; this provided the purchase of the property was made during marriage. Therefore, the OP's fear may be of academical interests only.
The OP has stated that the house is owned by his company and that he has a prenuptial agreement. Provided the prenup was properly registered at the time of their marriage and based on the facts, as I understand them, the wife has little chance of claiming the house as Sin Somros during a divorce proceeding or of proving outright ownership.
Posted 2009-07-05 02:58:17
OP! 
This is a serious situation involving lots of money, don't put your trust in internet forum posts... GET A LAWYER. Preferably, talk to 3 or 4 about your situation to make sure their advice is legitimate. All the BS on this topic about what the blue book "means" or what "Thai law says" is useless when you get in front of a judge... Thai law is about ENFORCEABILITY, not what's officially written in the code. It could be that the local judges pays full heed to the code in situations like your's, or he could ignore every law and just wait for bribes from the parties... so get solid advice first.
Edited by Svenn, 2009-07-05 02:59:17.
Posted 2009-07-05 04:57:55
InterestedObserver, on 2009-07-04 18:02:38, said: thaiwanderer, on 2009-07-04 14:51:21, said: .........or the builder built it for you (construction contract)
Hence my previous post questioning whether the OP's company can easily establish ownership of the house to a prospective buyer (he's in a rush to sell).
If not will take at least more than 30 days and as he doesn't know what documents he signed he may have granted wife a 3 year lease.
If you are having a house built for yourself, make sure that you get your name on the building permit. A construction contract between you and the builder is exactly that, it won't prove ownership in the future. Only the building permit or a sales agreement will do that. If the land is owned by a company, then you should secure a 30 year lease and then get the building permit in your name.
Yes, was merely adding an extra document that may be involved. Building Permit together with sale and purchase / construction contract is important but is not of itself registration of ownership of the house.
For the OP as the blue book was in the name of the builder imagine (but may well be wrong) the building permit was too. Given his reliance on his wife and inability to read Thai quite possible ownership of the house (regardless of the name on the building permit) has not been registered to his company (and he doesn't know what he signed anyway). The OP says his company owns the house but not at all clear its ownership of the house is registered (and he might of paid for the house but are all the documents even establishing 'non-registered' ownership in order?).
As stated earlier he wishes to sell and a prospective buyer may well be put off if he hasn't already got everything in order to show ownership of the land and house.
Given wife attempting to be difficult he should take legal advice and ensure everything solid as it can be.
Posted 2009-07-05 12:53:40
The house in question is registered to somebody since a Thor Ror 14 (blue book) has been issued by the local Amphur. Therefore, non-registered ownership cannot be asserted. At this point I'd pay a good real estate lawyer to perform Due Diligence (title search) on the property, including the house.
Posted 2009-07-05 13:15:10
How much does a reasonable lwayer charge to do due diligence? Just curious as "my wife" will be "buying" land soon. Price of land 800000 baht.
We called the land dept or whatever its called who told us that the name on the copy of the Chanote was the owner etc.
Edited by yabaaaa, 2009-07-05 13:16:59.
Posted 2009-07-05 15:56:26
InterestedObserver, on 2009-07-05 13:53:40, said: The house in question is registered to somebody since a Thor Ror 14 (blue book) has been issued by the local Amphur. Therefore, non-registered ownership cannot be asserted. At this point I'd pay a good real estate lawyer to perform Due Diligence (title search) on the property, including the house.
The 'registered' ownership I was referring to was of the house itself with the land office.
As I said earlier whilst the OP / his company may have paid for the house and land its not at all clear what if any documents he has and what is registered at the land office.
Whilst the OP was concerned about the wife's claims, the blue book and the advice he received they are really false leads and due dilligence (on house and land) as you say is essential. I suspect this will show the OP needs to take some action to tidy up the legalities ready for sale.
Posted 2009-07-05 17:03:41
InterestedObserver, on 2009-07-04 17:02:38, said: If you are having a house built for yourself, make sure that you get your name on the building permit. A construction contract between you and the builder is exactly that, it won't prove ownership in the future. Only the building permit or a sales agreement will do that. If the land is owned by a company, then you should secure a 30 year lease and then get the building permit in your name.
land offices (at least in Ko Phangan so i assume its the rule everywhere) will not issue a building permit in the name of a foreigner. it must be a Thai person or Thai owned company.
Posted 2009-07-05 17:43:38
stevehaigh, on 2009-07-05 11:03:41, said: InterestedObserver, on 2009-07-04 17:02:38, said: If you are having a house built for yourself, make sure that you get your name on the building permit. A construction contract between you and the builder is exactly that, it won't prove ownership in the future. Only the building permit or a sales agreement will do that. If the land is owned by a company, then you should secure a 30 year lease and then get the building permit in your name.
land offices (at least in Ko Phangan so i assume its the rule everywhere) will not issue a building permit in the name of a foreigner. it must be a Thai person or Thai owned company.
Seems to be the same here in Hua Hin Thai Person or Thai owned company can only get a Building Permit.
In the same boat as the OP and have the BP in the company name, however think I will go the superficies route to claim ownership of the property:
http://www.thailandl...s_thailand.html
What do you think?
Edited by jflundy, 2009-07-05 17:44:28.
Posted 2009-07-05 18:38:53
jflundy, on 2009-07-05 17:43:38, said: stevehaigh, on 2009-07-05 11:03:41, said: InterestedObserver, on 2009-07-04 17:02:38, said: If you are having a house built for yourself, make sure that you get your name on the building permit. A construction contract between you and the builder is exactly that, it won't prove ownership in the future. Only the building permit or a sales agreement will do that. If the land is owned by a company, then you should secure a 30 year lease and then get the building permit in your name.
land offices (at least in Ko Phangan so i assume its the rule everywhere) will not issue a building permit in the name of a foreigner. it must be a Thai person or Thai owned company.
Seems to be the same here in Hua Hin Thai Person or Thai owned company can only get a Building Permit.
In the same boat as the OP and have the BP in the company name, however think I will go the superficies route to claim ownership of the property:
http://www.thailandl...s_thailand.html
What do you think?
Certainly you have to have real land rights in your name ( superficies, lease etc.) before you can get a building permit with your name on it. Whoever said that you can just throw up a building anywhere you wish, without the land owners permission.
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