Posted 2009-12-25 22:58:41
 trogers, on 2009-12-22 10:42:03, said:
yabaaaa, on 2009-12-22 09:27:44, said: richm7, on 2009-11-22 18:00:11, said: I'm sorry but I have huge concerns with these claims of over 10% return on rentals. That implies a rental of almost 1% per month on the value, or a THB10M condo renting for THB90K a month. Sorry folks, but it is not going to happen, and if anyone who claims it does happen would like to substantiate it, I'll be the first in queue to get in on it. If you don't believe me, take a stroll through the real estate ads or around some of the agents downtown BKK and see for yourself. I'd dearly love to get THB90k a month for my THB11M downtown unit but a more reasonable THB50-60k is all I'll ever see. And mine is a large unit in a well run, desirable building, not one of these rabbit hutches where you can't swing a cat. Beware of asking price rentals; they often bear little relationship to the REAL rental value and are usually stubborn owners with an inflated sense of value. Needless to say, their units sit empty for years. Anyone can ask. Getting is another matter.
Having said that, a 6% gross return is more like the general rule, or a THB10M condo renting for THB50k a month. Which is not at all bad in the current market. Adjust that number for costs (CAM fees etc) and you're looking at 5% net. Not too shabby.
Rentals, even in the current market, should be at 80% plus occupancy (condo building). If they are not, there will be a very good reason. Don't become a victim of that reason or your investment will disappear faster than a tequila down a bar girls throat
I really think then that you dont know what your talking about if you dont see a 10% return and no Im not going to publish where and when as every Tom Dick and Harry will be here next.
Nobody mentioned 10mil baht condos try going down to 1 million+ and no it isnt a dump and yes its has just been repainted on the ground floor after 3.5 years from NEW so they are taking care of the maintenance pretty well.
The "rabbit hutches" are way out performing your "luxury palaces" Im happy with my hutches but then I did some research the first being whats the largest possible market for 1. a 10 million baht condo or 2. a 1 million baht condo 3. buying at the right time 72baht per £ 
Smaller units in middle grounds are easier to let out. Gross return is one aspect, but the overheads to administer the lease will be higher unless the landlord has several units in the same location to spread the overheads.
I have 3 units in the same development - two 1-bed and one 2-bed. The 1-beds are giving gross return of 9.4%, while the 2-bed is giving 8.9%.
my experience (but not in bkk) has been that cheaper properties give a better rental return, but not capital appreciation necessarily. However, as I change my focus to retirement income rather than capital gain your examples interest me, are you finding it easy to attract tenants & are they typically farang you target or Thai’s?
Posted 2009-12-25 23:14:00
trogers, on 2009-11-19 12:40:35, said: fivestar, on 2009-11-19 12:33:58, said: These are for 1 year rental contracts.
regards
Robert
Great. What's the average occupany rate of a building in good and moderate location during peak and off peak periods? Over 85%?
I bought in Bangkok. Occupancy rate 100%.
So far my condo has appreciated in value 50% in 4 years.
Why in heavens name would anyone consider investing in "Mayaswellbelivingonthemoonaburi" is beyond me 
You will lose money for sure.
Edited by Livinginexile, 2009-12-25 23:16:47.
Posted 2009-12-26 00:08:43
Royspurs, on 2009-12-25 22:58:41, said: trogers, on 2009-12-22 10:42:03, said: yabaaaa, on 2009-12-22 09:27:44, said: richm7, on 2009-11-22 18:00:11, said: I'm sorry but I have huge concerns with these claims of over 10% return on rentals. That implies a rental of almost 1% per month on the value, or a THB10M condo renting for THB90K a month. Sorry folks, but it is not going to happen, and if anyone who claims it does happen would like to substantiate it, I'll be the first in queue to get in on it. If you don't believe me, take a stroll through the real estate ads or around some of the agents downtown BKK and see for yourself. I'd dearly love to get THB90k a month for my THB11M downtown unit but a more reasonable THB50-60k is all I'll ever see. And mine is a large unit in a well run, desirable building, not one of these rabbit hutches where you can't swing a cat. Beware of asking price rentals; they often bear little relationship to the REAL rental value and are usually stubborn owners with an inflated sense of value. Needless to say, their units sit empty for years. Anyone can ask. Getting is another matter.
Having said that, a 6% gross return is more like the general rule, or a THB10M condo renting for THB50k a month. Which is not at all bad in the current market. Adjust that number for costs (CAM fees etc) and you're looking at 5% net. Not too shabby.
Rentals, even in the current market, should be at 80% plus occupancy (condo building). If they are not, there will be a very good reason. Don't become a victim of that reason or your investment will disappear faster than a tequila down a bar girls throat
I really think then that you dont know what your talking about if you dont see a 10% return and no Im not going to publish where and when as every Tom Dick and Harry will be here next.
Nobody mentioned 10mil baht condos try going down to 1 million+ and no it isnt a dump and yes its has just been repainted on the ground floor after 3.5 years from NEW so they are taking care of the maintenance pretty well.
The "rabbit hutches" are way out performing your "luxury palaces" Im happy with my hutches but then I did some research the first being whats the largest possible market for 1. a 10 million baht condo or 2. a 1 million baht condo 3. buying at the right time 72baht per £
Smaller units in middle grounds are easier to let out. Gross return is one aspect, but the overheads to administer the lease will be higher unless the landlord has several units in the same location to spread the overheads.
I have 3 units in the same development - two 1-bed and one 2-bed. The 1-beds are giving gross return of 9.4%, while the 2-bed is giving 8.9%.
my experience (but not in bkk) has been that cheaper properties give a better rental return, but not capital appreciation necessarily. However, as I change my focus to retirement income rather than capital gain your examples interest me, are you finding it easy to attract tenants & are they typically farang you target or Thai's?
My tenants so far in my condo units are a single Aussie, a French and his Thai gf, and 2 girls from the Philippines (both working in the Middle East and use Thailand as a holiday base). My next tenant early next year is a Brit with Thai wife and 2 young kids.
My units at Prakhanong in a 13-year old development has good rental yield, but like you said, low cap appreciation. Just bought a 1-bed unit off the first owner (Thai). She bought it at Bt1.78m from the developer and I paid her Bt1.95m after 13 years as the unit has never been renovated for that duration.
One advantage of buying 2nd hand condo units is that we can experience first hand the living environment and the communal spirit. Rental yield can be relative high if the location, environment and community is good. I bought additional units here because I stayed in one of the units since Jan this year and is happy with the living conditions.
Edited by trogers, 2009-12-26 00:19:04.
Posted 2009-12-27 08:55:08
Livinginexile, on 2009-12-25 23:14:00, said: trogers, on 2009-11-19 12:40:35, said: fivestar, on 2009-11-19 12:33:58, said: These are for 1 year rental contracts.
regards
Robert
Great. What's the average occupany rate of a building in good and moderate location during peak and off peak periods? Over 85%?
I bought in Bangkok. Occupancy rate 100%.
So far my condo has appreciated in value 50% in 4 years.
Why in heavens name would anyone consider investing in "Mayaswellbelivingonthemoonaburi" is beyond me
You will lose money for sure.
If you bought in 2005 when the price index was in the high 120's. at the end of 3rd qtr 2009 it stood at 107 and could break the 1991 standard index of 100 this quarter. If you think your condos appreciated at 50%, you will have to know some complete idiot who wants to buy a condo at almost twice what they are worth in order to realize that dream. The data provided at the link below is not personal opinion. According to the Bank Of Thailand, foreign demand for property is off 90% of its decade high.
http://www.globalpro...d/Price-History
Posted 2009-12-27 10:47:34
Pakboong, on 2009-12-27 08:55:08, said: Livinginexile, on 2009-12-25 23:14:00, said: trogers, on 2009-11-19 12:40:35, said: fivestar, on 2009-11-19 12:33:58, said: These are for 1 year rental contracts.
regards
Robert
Great. What's the average occupany rate of a building in good and moderate location during peak and off peak periods? Over 85%?
I bought in Bangkok. Occupancy rate 100%.
So far my condo has appreciated in value 50% in 4 years.
Why in heavens name would anyone consider investing in "Mayaswellbelivingonthemoonaburi" is beyond me
You will lose money for sure.
If you bought in 2005 when the price index was in the high 120's. at the end of 3rd qtr 2009 it stood at 107 and could break the 1991 standard index of 100 this quarter. If you think your condos appreciated at 50%, you will have to know some complete idiot who wants to buy a condo at almost twice what they are worth in order to realize that dream. The data provided at the link below is not personal opinion. According to the Bank Of Thailand, foreign demand for property is off 90% of its decade high.
http://www.globalpro...d/Price-History
Is this the reason why recently completed luxury condo like The Emporio and Milleinium Residence are looking like haunted towers? Cannot find some complete idiots to buy them at Bt130+k per m2?
Posted 2009-12-27 14:47:07
Is this the reason why recently completed luxury condo like The Emporio and Milleinium Residence are looking like haunted towers? Cannot find some complete idiots to buy them at Bt130+k per m2?
[/quote]
Somebody falls off the turnip truck everyday and there is no telling what they are likely to do.
Posted 2010-01-12 03:31:11
ThaiSunshine, on 2009-11-21 14:44:44, said: If you want a heavy return on your investment you should consider the new property hot spot in Thailand!
I am talking about the beachfront resort town of Khanom, located at the mainland opposite Koh Samui.
We have one Thai Bali style condo complex ready to move in this December.
Phase 2 of this condo complex will be ready to move in late 2010.
You can find more info about this project here:
Beachfront Condo
I've only got a few units in Phase 1 left.... and for Phase 2 you'll save a lot of money buying off plan.
New property hot spot? The place doesn't even have it's own Wikipedia entry! lol
If you want to promote the area I suggest you create one.
Posted 2010-10-20 15:22:29
Since the troubles earlier this year, is it still worth investing in residential property for retirement income? The condos seem to be going up all over BKK so I would be concerned about over supply and as a result price slashing of rents reducing potential income. Starting to look into various possibilities, but this one still seems interesting. Keeping money in the bank will just not work, as the interest would not provide enough to live on (0.85% at present).
Posted 2010-10-20 19:30:03
GarryP, on 2010-10-20 15:22:29, said:
Since the troubles earlier this year, is it still worth investing in residential property for retirement income? The condos seem to be going up all over BKK so I would be concerned about over supply and as a result price slashing of rents reducing potential income. Starting to look into various possibilities, but this one still seems interesting. Keeping money in the bank will just not work, as the interest would not provide enough to live on (0.85% at present).
Property depreciates in Thailand quickly(2-3%) a year. With buying and selling transaction costs, vacancies(there will be many) and maintenance, it's difficult to make money on property.
Apartments you see being build now are Thai insiders acquiring long dormant land and putting it to use. Their cost of acquisition and construction is very low, so they can focus on very long term returns.
Buy your own home if you are sure to stay. Put the rest of your money in a brokerage account.
http://www.globalpro...d/Price-History
Posted 2010-10-23 03:07:07
bangkokjohn, on 2010-10-20 19:30:03, said:
GarryP, on 2010-10-20 15:22:29, said:
Since the troubles earlier this year, is it still worth investing in residential property for retirement income? The condos seem to be going up all over BKK so I would be concerned about over supply and as a result price slashing of rents reducing potential income. Starting to look into various possibilities, but this one still seems interesting. Keeping money in the bank will just not work, as the interest would not provide enough to live on (0.85% at present).
Property depreciates in Thailand quickly(2-3%) a year. With buying and selling transaction costs, vacancies(there will be many) and maintenance, it's difficult to make money on property.
Apartments you see being build now are Thai insiders acquiring long dormant land and putting it to use. Their cost of acquisition and construction is very low, so they can focus on very long term returns.
Buy your own home if you are sure to stay. Put the rest of your money in a brokerage account.
http://www.globalpro...d/Price-History
From your link
"Acceptable yields, in a system which favours landlords
The average rental yield in Bangkok is around 7.2% in 2009, down from around 7.6% during the previous year, according to Global Property Guide research. The highest yields come from condominiums measuring between 80 to 120 sq. m., which have yields exceeding 7.5%"
Working on this % above I "should" be getting 8400 baht a month from each of my condos I rent out BUT I am in fact getting 12000+ baht a month, and this is reduced from the 14000 I used to get as prices have dropped recenlty. It really depends what you bought when you bought it and where you bought it.
Buying at "the right time" made a huge difference ie when Sterling was at +70 baht, I would NOT buy any condos today.
Posted 2010-10-23 06:50:46
bangkokjohn, on 2010-10-20 19:30:03, said:
Buy your own home if you are sure to stay. Put the rest of your money in a brokerage account.
Ask the millions who had lost a sizable portion of their retirement funds in brokerage accounts during 2007-2008 if they will go through it all again.
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