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Honda Phantom Ta200


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#1 griz47

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Posted 2010-02-12 14:11:10

Three falang have bought Honda Phantom in Kalasin in the last 4 months and all have problems. Mine i bought in December and it was noisy and i now find it is burning nearly 1 Litre of oil every 1000Kl, another guy i know has complained because after a few kilometres his is very noisy and the 3rd guy when he pulls the clutch to engage gear the bike screetches. <deleted> is happening, I had one of these for 4 years and the only problem I had (apart from the untrained mechanics in the Honda shops) was the anodising on the front forks. Has anyone else had problems with these bikes?

#2 billd766

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Posted 2010-02-12 14:21:51

Sorry to hear of you and your friends problems.

I have a 2005 model which I bought at the end of June last year.

Since then I have clocked nearly 8,500 km and the only problems I have had are the front indicator bulbs have failed a couple of times at 30 baht a time and the main fuse blew at a cost od 5 baht.

I also replaced the saddle with on original as hte one it came with looked very pretty but was too thinly padded for my fat a**.

I have asked around about re-boring it and it looks as though it will not be an easy job.

One suggestion was that I get some baffles removed from the exhaust and this morning I asked at my local dealer the cost of a new exhaust pipe. 10k baht!!!!!!!!!!!

Forget that idea I think.

It is comfortable enough and reasonably cheap to run and it will do me a while yet.

As far as I know mine uses no oil between the 4000 km servicings.

#3 lovelomsak

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Posted 2010-02-12 15:36:57

I just got my new phantom last week I hear noises too. My first though was maybe they forgot to put oil in so I checked that it is ok . But has what I would call knocking noises like it is low on oil or piston isnot set right. i only have 500 kilo on it so far. other than the noises I love the bike nice ride responds good at high speeds and I really like the weigh it makes the ride so much more comfortable than my honda wave.

#4 griz47

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Posted 2010-02-12 15:40:10

Sorry to hear of you and your friends problems.

I have a 2005 model which I bought at the end of June last year.

Since then I have clocked nearly 8,500 km and the only problems I have had are the front indicator bulbs have failed a couple of times at 30 baht a time and the main fuse blew at a cost od 5 baht.

I also replaced the saddle with on original as hte one it came with looked very pretty but was too thinly padded for my fat a**.

I have asked around about re-boring it and it looks as though it will not be an easy job.

One suggestion was that I get some baffles removed from the exhaust and this morning I asked at my local dealer the cost of a new exhaust pipe. 10k baht!!!!!!!!!!!

Forget that idea I think.

It is comfortable enough and reasonably cheap to run and it will do me a while yet.

As far as I know mine uses no oil between the 4000 km servicings.



#5 griz47

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Posted 2010-02-12 15:57:21

If you have noise problems take it to the shop and complain. I had the oil changed for the first service but had a long ride to Korat so had the oil changed there at just over 2000klm. The guy showed me what he drained and there was about 1/2 a cup instead of a litre. When i complained after 2200klm their was a guy in the shop from honda Bangkok and he took it in hand. They are going to change the engine in mine because I said it was a new bike and I wouldn't accept a repaired engine and I refused to take the bike from the shop and it has now been there a week. A Swiss guy in the next village has a screetch when he operates the clutch but says there is a 3 year 30,000klm warranty so he's not concerned. Stupid bastard. A German is not happy because his is noisy but the shop has done something to quieten it and say if it reoccurs they will change the bike. I don't believe this because they have applied for registration so it would cock that up. I think they are just delaying it and hoping he won't go back. Do it the Thai way. Deny the problem and once you've paid the problom is yours.
TIT

#6 Traxster

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Posted 2010-02-13 07:40:56

Right...so I'm crossing the 'Honda Phantom Ta200' off my list then.

#7 msg362

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Posted 2010-02-13 07:47:25

Right...so I'm crossing the 'Honda Phantom Ta200' off my list then.

Buy a Kawa Boss ,cheaper and better!

#8 JSixpack

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Posted 2010-02-13 09:30:00

Right...so I'm crossing the 'Honda Phantom Ta200' off my list then.

Buy a Kawa Boss ,cheaper and better!


And you can run that one and so many others with no oil and then have no problems whatsoever. Only the Honda Phantom needs oil nowadays! Ain't technology grand?

#9 griz47

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Posted 2010-02-14 07:32:16

If you have noise problems take it to the shop and complain. I had the oil changed for the first service but had a long ride to Korat so had the oil changed there at just over 2000klm. The guy showed me what he drained and there was about 1/2 a cup instead of a litre. When i complained after 2200klm their was a guy in the shop from honda Bangkok and he took it in hand. They are going to change the engine in mine because I said it was a new bike and I wouldn't accept a repaired engine and I refused to take the bike from the shop and it has now been there a week. A Swiss guy in the next village has a screetch when he operates the clutch but says there is a 3 year 30,000klm warranty so he's not concerned. Stupid bastard. A German is not happy because his is noisy but the shop has done something to quieten it and say if it reoccurs they will change the bike. I don't believe this because they have applied for registration so it would cock that up. I think they are just delaying it and hoping he won't go back. Do it the Thai way. Deny the problem and once you've paid the problom is yours.
TIT

Yesterday I went into the shop and they showed me a load of parts, a piston, rings, gaskets, gudgeon pin, timing chain and said they were waiting for cylinder. I spit the dummy because I bought a new bike not a rebuilt bike. I had one of these for nearly 4 years and if I wanted a rebuilt engine I would have done that one up. This is typical Thailand, you get shit and the bastards expect you to accept it. the f------ bike can stay in the shop until it corrodes away. I paid for a new bike and that is what i want. My advice to everyone is to buy the Kawasaki Boss. 25cc less but similar performance and the exhaust tone is so much better than the Phantom. Made in Thailand? <deleted>.

#10 griz47

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Posted 2010-02-14 07:36:04

Right...so I'm crossing the 'Honda Phantom Ta200' off my list then.

You can buy mine if you want and cheap. I don't want the f------ thing.

#11 Bastogne

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Posted 2010-02-14 12:37:26

Yesterday I went into the shop and they showed me a load of parts, a piston, rings, gaskets, gudgeon pin, timing chain and said they were waiting for cylinder. I spit the dummy because I bought a new bike not a rebuilt bike. I had one of these for nearly 4 years and if I wanted a rebuilt engine I would have done that one up. This is typical Thailand, you get shit and the bastards expect you to accept it. the f------ bike can stay in the shop until it corrodes away. I paid for a new bike and that is what i want. My advice to everyone is to buy the Kawasaki Boss. 25cc less but similar performance and the exhaust tone is so much better than the Phantom. Made in Thailand? <deleted>.


The engine is not made in Thailand. Did you have a look at the spares parts? The parts I saw in Chiang-Mai are stamped "made in Indonesia".
It's seems that ASTRA HONDA INDONESIA produce there the HONDA TIGER 200 a touring bike motored by this 200cc engine and that Honda Thailand import this engine to in the made in Thailand shopper style frame. Both bikes are made in heavy mild-steel; to heavy for this small engine in my opinion.
Or is the engine made in China like the mechanic men told me in the maintenance shop of Honda Sengchai C-M?

Anyway don't worry griz47 I suppose the shop with fix it

#12 Bastogne

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Posted 2010-02-14 13:56:49

Oops, my answer to this post was gone to fast...

I was saying that you don't need to worry because after repair under warranty, you could be more lucky with this bike and, what is nice in Thailand, you will not lose so much money on the second hand market. Yesterday, I was in the biggest second hand market of the North which is open every saturday in SAN PATONG 35 km South of C-M. There, I saw some Phantom 3 years old sold at more than 60.000 Baht.

In my opinion, the Phantom engine is not the best quality but is far better that common Chinese production.
Anyway, you have no choice in this range of price.

From the same crankcase, Honda produce engines from 90cc to 250cc even 270cc for 1986 factory trial racing bike.
I am very specialized in single cylinder Honda small engines and have many of these included HRC 250cc bikes with magnesium crankcase here in my garage in Thailand. I had never the opportunity to open and compare the components of the Phantom with Honda Japan or Honda Thailand production.
What I like in the design of this engine is the long stroke that gives more torque and a smooth piston noise compared to short stroke for the new Honda production as Sonic, CBR150, Honda Clic, ...

I told already in an other post that if a Phantom with broken engine is for sale I could be interested in buying it to restore with bigger piston and, if it is possible, modify the valves, cam and timing and let somebody test ride it (shopper is not my style of riding).
But not your bike griz47, these one, like new and rebuild, will be to expensive for the purpose.

#13 griz47

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Posted 2010-02-14 16:47:43

Yesterday I went into the shop and they showed me a load of parts, a piston, rings, gaskets, gudgeon pin, timing chain and said they were waiting for cylinder. I spit the dummy because I bought a new bike not a rebuilt bike. I had one of these for nearly 4 years and if I wanted a rebuilt engine I would have done that one up. This is typical Thailand, you get shit and the bastards expect you to accept it. the f------ bike can stay in the shop until it corrodes away. I paid for a new bike and that is what i want. My advice to everyone is to buy the Kawasaki Boss. 25cc less but similar performance and the exhaust tone is so much better than the Phantom. Made in Thailand? <deleted>.


The engine is not made in Thailand. Did you have a look at the spares parts? The parts I saw in Chiang-Mai are stamped "made in Indonesia".
It's seems that ASTRA HONDA INDONESIA produce there the HONDA TIGER 200 a touring bike motored by this 200cc engine and that Honda Thailand import this engine to in the made in Thailand shopper style frame. Both bikes are made in heavy mild-steel; to heavy for this small engine in my opinion.
Or is the engine made in China like the mechanic men told me in the maintenance shop of Honda Sengchai C-M?
F------ fix it? On the old bike i had the forks changed under warranty and the bastards knocked the sleeves off with a screwdriver. I have photographs of the damage they caused. My ladies Click had scratches to the plastic because she dropped it and they said they would make it like new. They bought spray cans locally and all the red had the orange peel effect. It looked <deleted>. The bike was 3 weeks old. If they'd told me they couldn't do it I would have bought all new panels. When I complained about the finish they told me to buy lapping paste and do it myself. I totally spit the dummy and nearly wrecked the shop. I wouldn't trust the bastards here with a wheelbarrow.
Anyway don't worry griz47 I suppose the shop with fix it



#14 Kf6vci

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Posted 2010-02-15 09:24:14

While I don't know the statistics (% of all bike sales etc.) for the Phantom, one cannot help but notice the disproportionate number of Phantoms which are for sale. :)

Have a garage remove the cylinder head and take a look at the piston ring. Any signs of wear & tear? You could have the ring replaced. In case of excessive wear, why not replace the pistons with 1 oversize and get a rebore with honing and all? Just make sure to take it to a really good shop which is doing such jobs (or has connections to a specialist shop).

Ride on,
Chris

#15 billd766

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Posted 2010-02-15 14:39:29

While I don't know the statistics (% of all bike sales etc.) for the Phantom, one cannot help but notice the disproportionate number of Phantoms which are for sale. :)

Have a garage remove the cylinder head and take a look at the piston ring. Any signs of wear & tear? You could have the ring replaced. In case of excessive wear, why not replace the pistons with 1 oversize and get a rebore with honing and all? Just make sure to take it to a really good shop which is doing such jobs (or has connections to a specialist shop).

Ride on,
Chris


I would like to do something like that for my Phantom which is running very well but the problem is finding the really good shop in the first place.

I have asked on the forum (thread running here http://www.thaivisa....1#entry3336221) but nobody really seems to know anywhere which makes life not so easy.

Most Honda dealers out in the provinces don't deal with Phantoms but they can get the parts and do basic servicing work though I wouldn't trust my local dealer to strip and rebuild mine, (no real experience) and I don't live near enough to BKK, Chiang Mai, Pattaya etc to pop down there and back in a day as I am 1/2 way between BKK and Chiang Mai.

While I can speak and understand Thai a little bit explaining that I want a re-bore etc is way out of my skill set.

#16 Kf6vci

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Posted 2010-02-16 08:44:24

This is scary - you better expect major engine damage! Hope you get a replacement bike. I once destroyed an engine due to not monitoring the oil...

Good luck!

Bill D, maybe you can find a Phantom Owners Group? The enthusiasts know the places for such a job.

Chris

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#17 villagefarang

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Posted 2010-02-16 08:55:12

Sure I'd like a bigger bike but so far I have had no problems with my Phantom at all. For the price it is much nicer on longish rides than a scooter.

#18 sk1max

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Posted 2010-02-16 08:57:10

Right...so I'm crossing the 'Honda Phantom Ta200' off my list then.

Buy a Kawa Boss ,cheaper and better!


I sold my low mileage Phantom because it was getting very noisy, bought a Boss...... 25,000 kms later not one noise or problem, more comfortable too.

#19 billd766

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Posted 2010-02-16 14:27:06

This is scary - you better expect major engine damage! Hope you get a replacement bike. I once destroyed an engine due to not monitoring the oil...

Good luck!

Bill D, maybe you can find a Phantom Owners Group? The enthusiasts know the places for such a job.

Chris


The only Phantom owners group I have found so far were very helpful but unfortunately based in Singapore.

#20 SweatySock

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Posted 2010-02-16 14:48:46

Had my Phantom just over 2 years.
Just completed 12,000 km and have not had a bit of bother with it.
Ride it to and from work everyday (round trip of 60 km).
I have had it serviced at the recommended times and fingers crossed it will keep on going.

#21 billd766

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Posted 2010-02-18 15:32:38

Had my Phantom just over 2 years.
Just completed 12,000 km and have not had a bit of bother with it.
Ride it to and from work everyday (round trip of 60 km).
I have had it serviced at the recommended times and fingers crossed it will keep on going.


I bought mine at the end of June last year with 5,500km and 3 previous farang owners in the last 4 years.

Now I have just over 14,500 km on it and the biggest problem so far is that it vibrates a bit and the front indicator bulbs fail frequently at a cost of 30 baht a time.

The front tyre is a bit worn but the back tyre is still good so I will replace them both next week and hope that the vibration decreases.

#22 Samuian

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Posted 2010-02-18 15:39:20

@OP:

Simple, cause it not a bike, it only has been made to look like one,
it's a tin can on 2 wheels, the sound and the looks of it make me puke!

Was the designer of this "bike" blind or random choice from many bad options ?

#23 Bearnagh

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Posted 2010-02-24 14:49:43

I bought a new Phantom exactly a year ago. The day & hour I got it there was a minor problem in that the throttle wasn't returning to idle properly. I could have fixed this myself but since the bike was literally 10 minutes old, I took it straight back to the large 'department store' where I'd just bought it. I figured that they should have the task of correcting the fault. The presence of such an obvious fault also made me realise that the bike could not have been properly PDI'd before it was handed over to me.... To my dismay, the 'mechanic' insisted on taking the carburettor off and stripping it all over the floor! He obtusely insisted that my problem was to do with the fuel jet rather than the much more obvious and simple culprit - a sticky cable, not routed correctly between the handlebars and the carb. (which is exactly what it later turned out to be!)

Two or three days afterwards it began to leak petrol a bit from the carb. I wasn't happy to take the bike back to the dealer again as I was already convinced that they hadn't a clue what they were doing. I went to a bike shop in Chiangmai which came highly recommended to me. There, the guy clearly did know about bikes and certainly knew the Phantom inside out. He was able to correct the fuel leak problem easily.

He told me something that I found very interesting. I have never checked the vailidy of this but I pass it onto you in the forum for your further "fat-chewing"...

He told me that the latest batch of Phantom engines (i.e. the TA200) were being made in China. He said that the build quality wasn't quite as good as it used to be. He told me to get the oil out of it immediately and replace it with a high quality oil, as the Chinese oil was very poor and could lead to early failure of things like cam-lobes and bearings etc. I did this, thinking that I'd rather spend 300 Baht than take the risk.

As I say, I don't know the validity of that information so I offer it here as unconfirmed.

Perhaps it's useful to someone?

Edited by Bearnagh, 2010-02-24 14:50:36.


#24 kitjohnson

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Posted 2010-10-26 12:42:32

I bought a new Phantom exactly a year ago. The day & hour I got it there was a minor problem in that the throttle wasn't returning to idle properly. I could have fixed this myself but since the bike was literally 10 minutes old, I took it straight back to the large 'department store' where I'd just bought it. I figured that they should have the task of correcting the fault. The presence of such an obvious fault also made me realise that the bike could not have been properly PDI'd before it was handed over to me.... To my dismay, the 'mechanic' insisted on taking the carburettor off and stripping it all over the floor! He obtusely insisted that my problem was to do with the fuel jet rather than the much more obvious and simple culprit - a sticky cable, not routed correctly between the handlebars and the carb. (which is exactly what it later turned out to be!)

Two or three days afterwards it began to leak petrol a bit from the carb. I wasn't happy to take the bike back to the dealer again as I was already convinced that they hadn't a clue what they were doing. I went to a bike shop in Chiangmai which came highly recommended to me. There, the guy clearly did know about bikes and certainly knew the Phantom inside out. He was able to correct the fuel leak problem easily.

He told me something that I found very interesting. I have never checked the vailidy of this but I pass it onto you in the forum for your further "fat-chewing"...

He told me that the latest batch of Phantom engines (i.e. the TA200) were being made in China. He said that the build quality wasn't quite as good as it used to be. He told me to get the oil out of it immediately and replace it with a high quality oil, as the Chinese oil was very poor and could lead to early failure of things like cam-lobes and bearings etc. I did this, thinking that I'd rather spend 300 Baht than take the risk.

As I say, I don't know the validity of that information so I offer it here as unconfirmed.

Perhaps it's useful to someone?


Can you tell me the name of the decent repair shop please? I've moved to CM and have a phantom.

I think I may need to change the bearings on mine and would like to do it myself. I've recently bought a few tools. I'll need to get one of those small metal tripod stands too.

Does anyone know where I should get parts like new bearings? Original/fake?

#25 aitch52

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Posted 2010-10-27 10:05:49

Hi Kit

Sorry can't help you out with the repair shop in Chiang Mai, but I use my local dealer in Nong Phai who has some good mechanics who are conversant with the Phantom. I had my front and rear wheel bearings changed, the bearings and seals cost 1700 Bah for both wheels, they are Honda originals manufactured in Japan. The front bearings were shot away and have come in useful as a babies rattles, the rear bearings could have probably done another 10,000 kms easily. The bike is almost 4 years old and I have done 26,000 kms on it from new.

THere was lateral movement in the front wheel and squeaking at low speeds, I guess as the front bearings take the majority of braking and steering loads, that is why they wear disproportianately. It took 2 sometimes 3 guys 2 hours to do the bearing job, a lot of that time was spent refitting the back wheel, about 40 mins,( it's a pigs orphan). Once that was done they discovered the rear brake was sticking so they wheeled into the shower (I know) and stripped, cleaned and re-assembled the brake unit. Total time involved 3 hours, labour charge 120 Baht. Probably the last great bargain in Thailand.

The sticky brake problem resurfaced again so I took it back to the shop and they did the same job on the rear unit and stripped, cleaned and re-assembled the master cylinder, bled and flushed the brake reservoir and system. 2 hours labour charge 90 Baht.

One interesting point about the master cylinder is that it is a worm drive piston, lateral movement is converted to rotary movement and keeps the piston centralised in the cylinder, I have never seen that before, dam_n clever these designers.

Hope that helps





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