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[Aussietrooper]

I heard there was a drug on the market that helps your liver so you can drink more....anyone know the name of it?

[Beechboy]

You may be thinking of Milk Thistle, which is not a drug but a herb and and can be obtained from health stores.



The active content is silymarin, a substance the liver itself produces when self-repairing. Milk thistle therefore assists in this process


Google it.  Eg.
http://www.liversupp...milkthistle.htm

I take a course during my dry periods in order to help the liver repair, which it will always do without alcohol. The amount of improvement is dependent upon the state of the liver, which is quite a robust organ.



I would have thought that there is no drug or herb in the World that enables a person to "drink" more with inpunity. The above substances aids repair.

Edited by Beechboy, 2011-08-20 14:18:13.

[Sheryl]

Beechboy, on 2011-08-20 14:04:11, said:

....I would have thought that there is no drug or herb in the World that enables a person to "drink" more with inpunity. The above substances aids repair.

Correct.

The odds of anyone who is  looking for a drug that will enable them to drink more ending up with serious liver damage & other health problems are pretty good....

[chuckrivera]

Samarin 140 (Milk Thistle), available in most pharmacies.

[Aussietrooper]

Sheryl, on 2011-08-20 20:34:55, said:

Beechboy, on 2011-08-20 14:04:11, said:

....I would have thought that there is no drug or herb in the World that enables a person to "drink" more with inpunity. The above substances aids repair.

Correct.

The odds of anyone who is  looking for a drug that will enable them to drink more ending up with serious liver damage & other health problems are pretty good....

Not if I take this drug I won't!!!!

[GrahamF]

Here's the link to an article I found concerning Alcoholism.  It's fairly broad, but it does contain info on meds, herbs and other methods used to treat alcoholics.

http://www.umm.edu/a...lism-000002.htm

In regards to Milk Thistle it states:
"Milk thistle (Silybum marianum) -- Milk thistle is often used to treat liver problems, and some studies looking at milk thistle to treat alcoholic liver disease have found significant improvements in liver function. People with the mildest form of alcohol related liver damage seem to improve the most. Milk thistle is less effective for those with severe liver disease such as cirrhosis, which is characterized by scarring and permanent, irreversible damage to the liver. However, there are no studies looking at whether milk thistle is useful for alcohol withdrawal."

[Gonsalviz]

It was explained to me that the only effective way for this to work is have the milk thistle in a liquid for dispensed into a light alcoholic drink.
The tablets do not work or not nearly as well.

[Beechboy]

Gonsalviz, on 2011-08-21 07:51:42, said:

It was explained to me that the only effective way for this to work is have the milk thistle in a liquid for dispensed into a light alcoholic drink.
The tablets do not work or not nearly as well.

I think that you were possibly mis-informed.



There are no contradictions between alcohol and milk thistle, so you can take it whilst drinking and there may or may not be benefits. I don't think such research has been undertaken.



The best way to gain maximum benefit from this, otherwise harless, product is to abstain from booze completely (or virtually) and enable it to assist the liver in it's self-improvement.



Dependent upon the state of the organ, even a two week course of abstainance and milk thistle can do lots of good. Longer is better for sure.



All quite obvious really.



P.S. They are capsules actually, which can be opened up and the powder stirred with other liquids, like tea (?) for example.

Edited by Beechboy, 2011-08-21 16:28:48.

[RickThai]

If you drink enough that you think you are damaging your liver, the smart thing to do would be to stop drinking.  Liver disease is one hell of a painful way to die.  

As one poster pointed out, once liver cells die, they form scar tissue and scar tissue will not "repair" itself, nor will it "regenerate" new liver cells.  

Livers do not really repair themselves, but healthy liver cells can generate new liver cells to help replace dead ones.  However, there is a limit to that and eventually a liver reaches a point of "no return" where even total abstinence from alcohol will not save you from a debilitating and painful death.  Only a liver transplant can help at that stage.  (I got mine three years ago. )

Edited by RickThai, 2011-08-22 22:38:53.

[Aussietrooper]

RickThai, on 2011-08-22 22:38:26, said:

If you drink enough that you think you are damaging your liver, the smart thing to do would be to stop drinking.  Liver disease is one hell of a painful way to die.  

As one poster pointed out, once liver cells die, they form scar tissue and scar tissue will not "repair" itself, nor will it "regenerate" new liver cells.  

Livers do not really repair themselves, but healthy liver cells can generate new liver cells to help replace dead ones.  However, there is a limit to that and eventually a liver reaches a point of "no return" where even total abstinence from alcohol will not save you from a debilitating and painful death.  Only a liver transplant can help at that stage.  (I got mine three years ago. )

Do you still drink now?

[RickThai]

Aussietrooper, on 2011-08-23 13:19:02, said:

RickThai, on 2011-08-22 22:38:26, said:

If you drink enough that you think you are damaging your liver, the smart thing to do would be to stop drinking.  Liver disease is one hell of a painful way to die.  

As one poster pointed out, once liver cells die, they form scar tissue and scar tissue will not "repair" itself, nor will it "regenerate" new liver cells.  

Livers do not really repair themselves, but healthy liver cells can generate new liver cells to help replace dead ones.  However, there is a limit to that and eventually a liver reaches a point of "no return" where even total abstinence from alcohol will not save you from a debilitating and painful death.  Only a liver transplant can help at that stage.  (I got mine three years ago. )

Do you still drink now?

Not a drop in over 4 years.  I stopped drinking about a year before I went into End-stage Liver Diesease (ESLD).  The amount of pain and misery I endured for almost 8 months was enough to cure me from drinking forever.  I am happy to say, that I have absolutely no desire to drink.  Friends still drink around me, and my wife orders a cocktail now and then for dinner, but I'm happy just drinking a soda or tea.

Regards,

RickThai

[FBN]

The more conventional drug for this is "Essentiale" ; I have seen it in BKK pharmacies.  This is a combination of vitamins and minerals and does seem to work well.  It will not "cure" a damaged liver but helps with the detox process.  Magnesium supplements are also often overlooked in managing alcohol induced liver damage so useful to take supplements of this as well.

[Aussietrooper]

FBN, on 2011-08-25 11:06:35, said:

The more conventional drug for this is "Essentiale" ; I have seen it in BKK pharmacies.  This is a combination of vitamins and minerals and does seem to work well.  It will not "cure" a damaged liver but helps with the detox process.  Magnesium supplements are also often overlooked in managing alcohol induced liver damage so useful to take supplements of this as well.

Im double dosing on this stuff....sounds like the dogs!!

[Aussietrooper]

Update on the liver.....all is good and I'm back on the hard stuff.

[RickThai]

Aussietrooper, on 2011-08-31 17:31:09, said:

Update on the liver.....all is good and I'm back on the hard stuff.

Famous last words, no doubt.

Good luck.

[GentlemanJim]

Aussietrooper

I find it strange on a forum titled "I drink too much" where most people come to want help to get off the evil brew, you come on to the forum wanting to change the title to "I want to drink too much".  I need to understand your rationale. I am not being critical of you at all, but scanning this forum does bring home to me how devastating excess alcohol can be in every aspect of life. Having read the threads on this forum, why do you want to continue to drink more, indeed searching for a drug or herb that facilitates you to drink more. Drinking more under the idea that Milk Thistle, will save you cannot be true, at best it will just slow down a little the inevitable. Just sayin!

[RickThai]

GentlemanJim, on 2011-10-10 11:15:40, said:

Aussietrooper

I find it strange on a forum titled "I drink too much" where most people come to want help to get off the evil brew, you come on to the forum wanting to change the title to "I want to drink too much".  I need to understand your rationale. I am not being critical of you at all, but scanning this forum does bring home to me how devastating excess alcohol can be in every aspect of life. Having read the threads on this forum, why do you want to continue to drink more, indeed searching for a drug or herb that facilitates you to drink more. Drinking more under the idea that Milk Thistle, will save you cannot be true, at best it will just slow down a little the inevitable. Just sayin!

GentlemanJim,

Your response shows that you are indeed a gentleman!

To any and all, who take supplements and continue to drink, I pose the following questions:
  
Do you get your liver tested regularly?

If so, how high is your ALT and AST?

I stopped drinking 4 years ago, and after a liver transplant and clearing the Hepatitis C virus, my ALT and AST (which are tested almost monthly) run steady  in the high teens (16-22).

Normal for a male is below 50.

So if these supplements are really negating the adverse effects of alcohol, I would imagine yours would be lower than 50 or so.

Seeing real numbers, might help convince people that the supplements really do some good.

Otherwise, maybe you are only fooling yourselves and using the supplements as an excuse to go on drinking and destroying your liver.

It would certainly be interesting to see some proof.

RickThai

[Ijustwannateach]

I think we are seeing the alcoholic version of 'moral hazard' here- where someone who thinks he insulated from risks actually takes more risks than he would if he didn't believe he were insulated.  I'm with Sheryl, here, on the outcome.

[GrahamF]

Ijustwannateach, on 2011-10-13 04:28:53, said:

I think we are seeing the alcoholic version of 'moral hazard' here- where someone who thinks he insulated from risks actually takes more risks than he would if he didn't believe he were insulated.  I'm with Sheryl, here, on the outcome.

Agreed, and I can see myself going down that path before I hit my bottom.  It would've been so easy to delude myself, again.

[Aussietrooper]

I'm still alive but not feeling so good, the "Essentiale" I was taking not helping anymore.....need something new....any fresh ideas???

[RickThai]

Aussietrooper, on 2011-10-20 17:00:55, said:

I'm still alive but not feeling so good, the "Essentiale" I was taking not helping anymore.....need something new....any fresh ideas???

See a doctor that specializes in liver diseases (Hepatologist), stop drinking NOW!

Even if you are a troll, just jerking everyone's chain, my advice is still good if you are a longtime, heavy drinker.

Rick

[GrahamF]

RickThai, on 2011-10-20 22:38:12, said:

Aussietrooper, on 2011-10-20 17:00:55, said:

I'm still alive but not feeling so good, the "Essentiale" I was taking not helping anymore.....need something new....any fresh ideas???

See a doctor that specializes in liver diseases (Hepatologist), stop drinking NOW!

Even if you are a troll, just jerking everyone's chain, my advice is still good if you are a longtime, heavy drinker.

Rick

I would add that if you do decide to stop drinking you may need to go to a detox first.  If there is an AA group in your area, they might know of a good place to go in your area.

[rucus7]

Aussietrooper, on 2011-10-20 17:00:55, said:

I'm still alive but not feeling so good, the "Essentiale" I was taking not helping anymore.....need something new....any fresh ideas???

Ah Aussietrooper, you keep coming  back like a bad penny.

[Aussietrooper]

rucus7, on 2011-10-24 17:29:02, said:

Aussietrooper, on 2011-10-20 17:00:55, said:

I'm still alive but not feeling so good, the "Essentiale" I was taking not helping anymore.....need something new....any fresh ideas???

Ah Aussietrooper, you keep coming  back like a bad penny.

I won't let the booze win!