20 replies to this topic

[jonboy]

I have a tourist tripple entry visa which allows me 2 months at a time which can be extended at the immigration office for 1,900 for 1 month extra.When I went to Sungai kolok border I was stamped in for 3 months.When I asked a few people what should I do I was told that if I had an official stamp saying to leave on November 2 then it was official.........

...I went to the Cambodian border yesterday and the officials there didn't seem to have the same take on the matter.They said I had overstayed by 1 month and had to pay 6200 baht(31 days x 200 baht).I argued it was an official stamp and that it wasn't my fault the lady had made a mistake.He eventually agreed that(all this was done politely and with smiles btw)it was half my fault(for not telling them earlier)and half the lady's fault at Sungai Kolok and therefore I should pay half.He then spent 20 mins trying to get hold of the lady over the phone and when he did he explained the situation.The lady said that basically it was my fault for not telling them earlier and that she wouldnt take ANY responsibility at all.I went on to say that I also wasn't taking any responsibility for this and  the reply was that(with a smile)he couldnt let me go through the border and that he must have me arrested for breaking the law???!! I obviously was not in the best position to bargain with him at the border as he had me by the short and curlies.I asked if he couldnt just sign this off as a simple mistake(hahaha)...NO chance(somebody had to pay).He offered that I could argue this out with the lady at Sungai Kolok if I wanted to but she couldnt speak any English...lol!...so back upto 6200 again    

By now all the others with the Jack Golf tour had been to the casino and eaten and were back in the cue and some going back to the van and there was me who hadn't even left thailand.Due to this and not wanting to piss off 14 other people and also not wanting to get arrested I had to pay the money.

My question is ...have any of you had similar experiences and what did you do?Do you think I'll ever see the money again if I complain to immigration office?You got any numbers of friendly immigration staff members?

Thanks  

Edited by jonboy, 2005-11-04 14:31:39.

[Axel]

Any immigration officer would tell you, you have to check if the validity is correct, if not ask to change it. Why? Because you applied for 2 months and know it, therefore a mistake must not be mis-used.
(Not really my logic, but explanations I got before, when immigration made mistakes with my datas)

[Firefan]

Jonboy; not much to add but thanks for the story. Some of us might have been in the same situation in the future and now know what is the correct approach. Cheers!

[lopburi3]

As has been said so many times.  If there is an error on your entry stamp have it corrected.  

You obviously did not ask the right people but if any of them are your friends perhaps they could help you pay the results of there bad advise.

I would just be glad that I could make it right with a payment and no jail or deportation.

[Eric Davis]

You knew you were trying it on and they caught ya.Simple as That.

[Thaipwriter]

jonboy, on 2005-11-04 14:29:40, said:

Do you think I'll ever see the money again if I complain to immigration office?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

    

[The Dude]

Dude, you tried to scam someone out of cash in Thailand? LOL. it's a 6200 baht tuition payment for you. No farang can scam Thailand out of cash; it never happens. A month's visa=money scam. As for getting your cash back; LOL too. No one gets money back in Thailand for anything after it leaves thy hand unless it is known deposit money (hotel or the like). you'll get over it; 6K is peanuts to you (that's what a Thai would say. "small money 'for you'). LOL

[fxm88]

Uh, oh. I think Immigration just figured out a new source of revenue. Let's see if this doesn't become a trend. You know, I'd expect this kind of "mistake" from the Cambodians but Thailand's historically been a little less sneaky about it.

Edited by fxm88, 2005-11-04 17:53:54.

[Axel]

I wonder, how often mistakes happen.
Bangkok immigration office has a separate counter to correct mistakes from Don Muang airport.  

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Johnno   ...   you are stuffed.

[Maestro]

jonboy, on 2005-11-04 08:29:40, said:

…not wanting to get arrested I had to pay the money.

Do you think I'll ever see the money again if I complain to immigration office?

You’ve got a receipt for it, I presume.

Write to the Prime Minister. I’m sure he’ll get you your money back.

------------
Maestro
“Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it.” _ Mark Twain

[Noel]

Whilst I empathise with you jonboy, you were on a hiding to nothing.
Yes I am very aware that hindsight is 20:20, but the moment you were offered the 50% reduction you should have filled his palm with both hands on the spot, so to speak.
In this type of situation, reasoning or appealing to logic and a sense of fair play will not get you far in most cases.
At least sharing your experience may well stress to others the importance of checking stamps on entry and having them corrected immediately if something is wrong.

'Caveat Emptor' is the reality.

[Maestro]

Axel, on 2005-11-04 08:35:50, said:

…you applied for 2 months

Does the visa application form say so? I think not.

Does the visa stamp say anything about 2 months for each entry? I think not.

Does a tourist have to study the immigration law of each country he visits? Obviously, yes.

And if a tourist does study Thailand’s Immigration Act, he will find the following:

Quote

Section 34
aliens entering into the kingdom for a temporary stay may enter for the below listed activities ;
3. Touring

Section 35
The Director General or the competent official deputized by the Director General shall have the authority to permit the alien , who entered to stay temporarily in the Kingdom under Section 34 , to remain in the Kingdom under any prescribed conditions. The periods of time which one is authorized to stay in the Kingdom are as Follows :
2. Not exceeding 90 days for a case under Section 34 (3)

The immigration officer who stamps the passport at the border is “the competent official deputized by the Director General”. Her 90-stamp was within the law. It may not have been within the guidelines of the Director General, but those guidelines are not available to the casual tourist.

Of course, a tourist would have to get himself arrested first and then hire a lawyer to argue this point. Any volunteers?  

------------
Maestro
“Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it.” _ Mark Twain

[fxm88]

Noel, on 2005-11-04 18:07:30, said:

At least sharing your experience may well stress to others the importance of checking stamps on entry and having them corrected immediately if something is wrong.

Yes, one mustn't forget to add 29, 59, 89 days, respectively, for the 30, 60, or 90 day entry permits -- not the 30, 60, or 90 days that a naif might assume.

In Soviet Russia Immigration stamps YOU.

[lopburi3]

The fact is the OP knew the limit and chose to ignore it.

Below is the validity period of a tourist visa as posted by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs (who are in charge of visa issue).  Not exactly a secret.

Quote

5. VALIDITY OF A STAY
Upon arrival, visitors with this type of visa will be permitted to stay in the Kingdom of Thailand for a period not exceeding 60 days at any time.

[lambous]

Axel, on 2005-11-04 14:35:50, said:

Any immigration officer would tell you, you have to check if the validity is correct, if not ask to change it. Why? Because you applied for 2 months and know it, therefore a mistake must not be mis-used.
(Not really my logic, but explanations I got before, when immigration made mistakes with my datas)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

My friend had a case where on a non immigrant visa he was stamped in for 30 days when it should have been 90. So in this case he's applied to stay for 90 days. If he turns up at the border to leave 90 days after coming in to Thailand he should be OK seeing as though that's what he was eligible for. Or will he have to deal with double standards.

Eligible for 30 days but receive 90 day stamp. Must pay 60 days overstay fine or
Eligible for 90 days but receive 30 day stam. Must pay 60 days overstay fine.

[Seen all,learnt nothing]

lambous, on 2005-11-04 19:16:54, said:

My friend had a case where on a non immigrant visa he was stamped in for 30 days when it should have been 90.
Eligible for 30 days but receive 90 day stamp. Must pay 60 days overstay fine or
Eligible for 90 days but receive 30 day stam. Must pay 60 days overstay fine.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

OP was told by imm. officer that is was half his, half their mistake.

So your friend has his answer. Split the difference and exit after 60 days. No fine. Let us know how he gets on.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

lambous, on 2005-11-04 19:16:54, said:

Axel, on 2005-11-04 14:35:50, said:

Any immigration officer would tell you, you have to check if the validity is correct, if not ask to change it. Why? Because you applied for 2 months and know it, therefore a mistake must not be mis-used.
(Not really my logic, but explanations I got before, when immigration made mistakes with my datas)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

My friend had a case where on a non immigrant visa he was stamped in for 30 days when it should have been 90. So in this case he's applied to stay for 90 days. If he turns up at the border to leave 90 days after coming in to Thailand he should be OK seeing as though that's what he was eligible for. Or will he have to deal with double standards.

Eligible for 30 days but receive 90 day stamp. Must pay 60 days overstay fine or
Eligible for 90 days but receive 30 day stam. Must pay 60 days overstay fine.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

By Law the responsibility for checking the stamp is down to the visa holder.

[lambous]

The immigration officer has a responsibility to stamp the correct date into one's passport.

[Axel]

lambous, on 2005-11-05 11:48:02, said:

The immigration officer has a responsibility to stamp the correct date into one's passport.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Absolutely, but if he makes a mistake, point it out and ask for correction.

[Noel]

Axel, on 2005-11-05 12:58:59, said:

lambous, on 2005-11-05 11:48:02, said:

The immigration officer has a responsibility to stamp the correct date into one's passport.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Absolutely, but if he makes a mistake, point it out and ask for correction.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

There have been several posts in the past referring to times when the officer has made a mistake to the detriment of the visitor (eg. given 30 days and not 90). I recall some members having had the error corrected a short while later at the Immigration Office, rather than trying to explain the mistake when leaving the country on potential overstay (no chance).
It therefore seems the system works both ways.

Purported ignorance of the law is generally considered no excuse worldwide as far as I am aware.
Even if the OP had been blissfully unaware of the error, under the law he would be expected to have known the law and checked his compliance.

Moreover, you may as well poke your finger in the eye of any Thai in a position of authority rather than tell them a countryman of their's screwed up...