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[R123]

Yes at last it came onto channel 7  !

I am a big Manny admirer, pound for pound the best boxer in the world; but in my opinion he would have been lucky to get a draw in this fight, but no way in my view did he win it(and i reckon he knew it too!).

Shows again why its dangerous to leave the decision to the judges.

Edited by R123, 2011-11-13 12:56:26.

[AGems]

I'm surprised by the judges decision! Saw Marquez slightly in front at the end of the 12 rounds...

[MrRed]

Marquez won that fight,i think it is now time Manny.

[tailspin]

Well that was one of the worst  title fights ever
I agreed with the decision,  Marquez had no power, and his best shot of the fight was the headbutt
Pacman knew Marquez couldn't hurt him, so coasted to an easy payday.  That's why Marquez was handpicked as opponent.
The whole fight consisted of everyone waiting for Pacman to drop this guy, including Marquez himself
I think these guys both like each other too much and so the final result was a win for them both and the promoters
Let's hope Pacman will go in search of better fights and fighters so he can establish himself as one of the greats

[tropo]

tailspin, on 2011-11-13 13:10:56, said:

Well that was one of the worst  title fights ever
I agreed with the decision,  Marquez had no power, and his best shot of the fight was the headbutt
Pacman knew Marquez couldn't hurt him, so coasted to an easy payday.  That's why Marquez was handpicked as opponent.
The whole fight consisted of everyone waiting for Pacman to drop this guy, including Marquez himself
I think these guys both like each other too much and so the final result was a win for them both and the promoters
Let's hope Pacman will go in search of better fights and fighters so he can establish himself as one of the greats

I had Marquez ahead on points and was very surprised by the result. I thought Pacquiao would have been lucky to draw.

Marquez made Pacquiao look ordinary. Mayweather will have loved this fight.

Pacman does not like Marquez, in fact if you knew Pacquiao better you would have detected some anger - followed by a lot of frustration after the first round.

[tailspin]

the only frustration was by the fans who had to suffer through this
btw I didn't realize you were friends with Pacman, can you please ask him to find some decent fights for the fans?
Thanks

tropo, on 2011-11-13 13:23:12, said:

tailspin, on 2011-11-13 13:10:56, said:

Well that was one of the worst  title fights ever
I agreed with the decision,  Marquez had no power, and his best shot of the fight was the headbutt
Pacman knew Marquez couldn't hurt him, so coasted to an easy payday.  That's why Marquez was handpicked as opponent.
The whole fight consisted of everyone waiting for Pacman to drop this guy, including Marquez himself
I think these guys both like each other too much and so the final result was a win for them both and the promoters
Let's hope Pacman will go in search of better fights and fighters so he can establish himself as one of the greats

I had Marquez ahead on points and was very surprised by the result. I thought Pacquiao would have been lucky to draw.

Marquez made Pacquiao look ordinary. Mayweather will have loved this fight.

Pacman does not like Marquez, in fact if you knew Pacquiao better you would have detected some anger - followed by a lot of frustration after the first round.

[tropo]

tailspin, on 2011-11-13 13:46:41, said:

the only frustration was by the fans who had to suffer through this
btw I didn't realize you were friends with Pacman, can you please ask him to find some decent fights for the fans?
Thanks

Pacquiao wasn't frustrated? Are you blind?

Yes, he comes from an area of the Philippines close to where my wife comes from. There's even some relatives who knew him personally way back when he was fighting for peanuts - they were boxers too.

[tailspin]

I see, you know somebody who knows somebody  who knows him, but you don't actually know him yourself, but you "know" what he is feeling?  Sorry, but it is impossible to look at a fighter and "know" what he is feeling...look at Ali, he used to do the old rubber leg thing after being hit to fool guys into thinking he was hurt.....professional fighters are actually masters at controlling their emotions.....it sounds like you may be projecting your frustration onto Pacman.....so we agree, we were all frustrated

here was the final punch count on the fight from espn

Ringside punch stats showed just how close the fight was. Pacquiao was credited with landing 176 of 578 punches, while Marquez landed 138 of 436.

The power punches were even closer, with Pacquiao connecting on 117 to 100 -- though Marquez seemed to land the harder punches.

Not sure how your scoring "system" showed the other guy winning?
Maybe you can share it here so we can all analyze it and help you

tropo, on 2011-11-13 13:55:10, said:

tailspin, on 2011-11-13 13:46:41, said:

the only frustration was by the fans who had to suffer through this
btw I didn't realize you were friends with Pacman, can you please ask him to find some decent fights for the fans?
Thanks

Pacquiao wasn't frustrated? Are you blind?

Yes, he comes from an area of the Philippines close to where my wife comes from. There's even some relatives who knew him personally way back when he was fighting for peanuts - they were boxers too.

Edited by tailspin, 2011-11-13 14:35:55.

[tropo]

tailspin, on 2011-11-13 14:21:48, said:

I see, you know somebody who knows somebody  who knows him, but you don't actually know him yourself, but you "know" what he is feeling?  Sorry, but it is impossible to look at a fighter and "know" what he is feeling...look at Ali, he used to do the old rubber leg thing after being hit to fool guys into thinking he was hurt.....professional fighters are actually masters at controlling their emotions.....it sounds like you may be projecting your frustration onto Pacman.....so we agree, we were all frustrated

here was the final punch count on the fight from espn

Ringside punch stats showed just how close the fight was. Pacquiao was credited with landing 176 of 578 punches, while Marquez landed 138 of 436.

The power punches were even closer, with Pacquiao connecting on 117 to 100 -- though Marquez seemed to land the harder punches.

Not sure how your scoring "system" showed the other guy winning?
Maybe you can share it here so we can all analyze it and help you

I've watched Pacquiao closely enough to notice a difference for this fight.

I'm no boxing judge as you're pretending to be, but with my limited view on a small TV screen I thought Marquez had the edge by a small margin. As it happened one judge scored it even, so it was very, very close. A lot of people including experts with more knowledge than you (not hard to find) gave the edge to Marquez.

I think it's time we both gave it a break and let some other people comment.

[WebBangkok]

I had it  a draw.
Although the rounds Marquez won, he did it clearly. The rounds Pac won could of gone either way.

Marquez look much sharper this time around at WW and not with a pot belly like his last attempt at WW.

Pac looks like he is on the decline, his footwork was not there and did not seem sharp at all. Pac looked tired to me after the 6th round onwards.

Marquez just always had Pac's number so it did not shock me how this fight played out.

I think Mayweather will now be willing to fight him, if Pac's legs are gone and on the decline, Mayweather should beat him.

Pac should have 1 or 2 fights max before he retires, you could tell he was not the same fighter he once was.

[tailspin]

Have to agree here, as I saw Pacman breathing through his mouth alot from Round 6 or so, so he may not have been in greatest shape of his career
He was also lunging badly on his overhand lefts(which he always did but not this bad),  and lifting his back foot off the ground so his balance and foot work was not quite there

A sharp fighter would have timed these lunges and stepped diagonally forward to either side,  and maybe knocked him out.

Luckily for him he was in with the soft hitting Marquez who backpedalled the whole fight

WebBangkok, on 2011-11-13 14:47:31, said:

I had it  a draw.
Although the rounds Marquez won, he did it clearly. The rounds Pac won could of gone either way.

Marquez look much sharper this time around at WW and not with a pot belly like his last attempt at WW.

Pac looks like he is on the decline, his footwork was not there and did not seem sharp at all. Pac looked tired to me after the 6th round onwards.

Marquez just always had Pac's number so it did not shock me how this fight played out.

I think Mayweather will now be willing to fight him, if Pac's legs are gone and on the decline, Mayweather should beat him.

Pac should have 1 or 2 fights max before he retires, you could tell he was not the same fighter he once was.

[RKeith]

This was the worse Pacquiao I've ever seen. Even Roach saw this and asked him to pick it up before Round 6 started. I believe Manny got lucky here. But the judges score cards can't be forced. I also saw the stats and Pac clearly won by an edge. Marquez connected punches, 138 of 436 to the 176 of 578 for the Filipino, and landed 100 power punches compared to his opponent's 117. Lucky Manny!




And geez, around the 10th, Nacho telling his fighter he's already winning. Imho, he lost this for Marquez. If he made a few more power connects on the last round, he would have had this in the bag.

Edited by RKeith, 2011-11-13 16:48:12.

[bhatmasterson]

This Pacman gets the daylights beaten out of him by Mayweather!

[chicagogato]

WebBangkok, on 2011-11-13 14:47:31, said:

I had it  a draw.
Although the rounds Marquez won, he did it clearly. The rounds Pac won could of gone either way.

Marquez look much sharper this time around at WW and not with a pot belly like his last attempt at WW.

Pac looks like he is on the decline, his footwork was not there and did not seem sharp at all. Pac looked tired to me after the 6th round onwards.

Marquez just always had Pac's number so it did not shock me how this fight played out.

I think Mayweather will now be willing to fight him, if Pac's legs are gone and on the decline, Mayweather should beat him.

Pac should have 1 or 2 fights max before he retires, you could tell he was not the same fighter he once was.

Mayweather has always been willing to beat Manny up and today you saw why. "The veil has been lifted."

http://www.fighthype...ntent11187.html

[tailspin]

Interesting analysis as it repeated some of the points I previously noted.  Based on pacman's perormance here and unwillingness to fight the best, I have had to adjust my all-time Asian boxing great list and downgrade him to number 5.

1.  Pancho Villa - Phil.
2.  Khaosai Galaxy-Thai
3.  Fighting Harada - Japan
4.  Yodsanan - Thai
5.  Pacman - Phil

I am hoping he will fight the best so he can become an all-time great and climb back up this exclusive list .

chicagogato, on 2011-11-13 20:08:13, said:

WebBangkok, on 2011-11-13 14:47:31, said:

I had it  a draw.
Although the rounds Marquez won, he did it clearly. The rounds Pac won could of gone either way.

Marquez look much sharper this time around at WW and not with a pot belly like his last attempt at WW.

Pac looks like he is on the decline, his footwork was not there and did not seem sharp at all. Pac looked tired to me after the 6th round onwards.

Marquez just always had Pac's number so it did not shock me how this fight played out.

I think Mayweather will now be willing to fight him, if Pac's legs are gone and on the decline, Mayweather should beat him.

Pac should have 1 or 2 fights max before he retires, you could tell he was not the same fighter he once was.

Mayweather has always been willing to beat Manny up and today you saw why. "The veil has been lifted."

http://www.fighthype...ntent11187.html

[tropo]

bhatmasterson, on 2011-11-13 18:01:26, said:

This Pacman gets the daylights beaten out of him by Mayweather!

Do you mean Mayweather will finally have the courage to face him? If people think the way you do, the value of that fight will have diminished significantly and Money Mayweather will be making a lot less money.

Pacquiao vs Mayweather has always had "snoozefest" written all over it.

[RKeith]

chicagogato, on 2011-11-13 20:08:13, said:

Mayweather has always been willing to beat Manny up and today you saw why. "The veil has been lifted."

http://www.fighthype...ntent11187.html

I read the article. And you said you saw why. Can you be more specific why? Mayweather has always been scared to tarnish his perfect record. Any professional boxer knows an opponent's performance is only part of his calibre. It's the boxer's style and ring habits that makes him dangerous. This is the main reason why Mayweather's scared to face Pacquiao. Boxing analysts have repeated now and again that Manny is made for Mayweather. Remember Hatton. The reason why the Marquez Pacquiao fight wasn't too exciting is because of Marquez defensive style. He knows how to keep Manny at a distance or else Manny'll be connecting shots and defeat him. This has always been the same since their second fight. That's also the reason why Pac was reported to have been training extra hard and early for this fight. Marquez is a wall. Manny's lucky he landed more punches than Marq. But we clearly saw Marq's power punches were cleaner. But there weren't enough numbers to get him a win. This is the problem with counter-punching. And freakin Nacho as well. Nevertheless, despite yesterday's fight having "fun" or not, a Pacquiao victory has been thought to be leading to Mayweather finally stepping in.

[WebBangkok]

chicagogato, on 2011-11-13 20:08:13, said:

WebBangkok, on 2011-11-13 14:47:31, said:

I had it  a draw.
Although the rounds Marquez won, he did it clearly. The rounds Pac won could of gone either way.

Marquez look much sharper this time around at WW and not with a pot belly like his last attempt at WW.

Pac looks like he is on the decline, his footwork was not there and did not seem sharp at all. Pac looked tired to me after the 6th round onwards.

Marquez just always had Pac's number so it did not shock me how this fight played out.

I think Mayweather will now be willing to fight him, if Pac's legs are gone and on the decline, Mayweather should beat him.

Pac should have 1 or 2 fights max before he retires, you could tell he was not the same fighter he once was.

Mayweather has always been willing to beat Manny up and today you saw why. "The veil has been lifted."

http://www.fighthype...ntent11187.html

Not sure about that.
He went on holidays and contradicts himself all the time.

What about the famous "Manny Pacuiao, You're next", then 20 minutes later, "I never said that, don't be putting words in my mouth" lol

Anyways this fight should of happen 2 years ago when both were clearly in their primes. A fight next year will still be big, but I think some of the excitement of this fight has gone a little. Seriously I am sick of hearing about these 2 anyway.

Edited by WebBangkok, 2011-11-14 11:59:59.

[tropo]

WebBangkok, on 2011-11-14 11:59:13, said:

Not sure about that.
He went on holidays and contradicts himself all the time.

What about the famous "Manny Pacuiao, You're next", then 20 minutes later, "I never said that, don't be putting words in my mouth" lol

Anyways this fight should of happen 2 years ago when both were clearly in their primes. A fight next year will still be big, but I think some of the excitement of this fight has gone a little. Seriously I am sick of hearing about these 2 anyway.

Pacquiao doesn't have a lot of good-fight options really. Pacquiao - Mayweather has just dropped half of its previous earning potential because of this outcome.  

Another fight with Marquez is his best option now. They'll have to sign it quickly before Mayweather tries to jump in as he may have grown some balls after watching this fight.

I would say that Pacquiao has really lucked out here - big time. He now has 2 mega fight options before he retires. Before he fights Mayweather he has to try to get a convincing win over Marquez.

Edited by tropo, 2011-11-14 14:30:16.

[tailspin]

tropo, on 2011-11-13 14:44:16, said:

tailspin, on 2011-11-13 14:21:48, said:

I see, you know somebody who knows somebody  who knows him, but you don't actually know him yourself, but you "know" what he is feeling?  Sorry, but it is impossible to look at a fighter and "know" what he is feeling...look at Ali, he used to do the old rubber leg thing after being hit to fool guys into thinking he was hurt.....professional fighters are actually masters at controlling their emotions.....it sounds like you may be projecting your frustration onto Pacman.....so we agree, we were all frustrated

here was the final punch count on the fight from espn

Ringside punch stats showed just how close the fight was. Pacquiao was credited with landing 176 of 578 punches, while Marquez landed 138 of 436.

The power punches were even closer, with Pacquiao connecting on 117 to 100 -- though Marquez seemed to land the harder punches.

Not sure how your scoring "system" showed the other guy winning?
Maybe you can share it here so we can all analyze it and help you

I've watched Pacquiao closely enough to notice a difference for this fight.

I'm no boxing judge as you're pretending to be, but with my limited view on a small TV screen I thought Marquez had the edge by a small margin. As it happened one judge scored it even, so it was very, very close. A lot of people including experts with more knowledge than you (not hard to find) gave the edge to Marquez.

I think it's time we both gave it a break and let some other people comment.

the great waffle master is back...first you had marquez ahead on "points", then you claim to have not really seen the fight due to an obstructed view but still saw enough to make a decision....was your scoring based on the 10 point must system?  why not post the scores here for our evaluation.....next thing you will tell us that you didn't really  see the fight but know someone who knows someone....etcetcetc.....haven't seen such backpedalling since...well Marquez.....a bit like an Italian Tank in ww2....2 forward speeds and 6 reverse....

You did finally get one thing right in a later post, I don't think the Mayweather Pacman fight will live up to its billing..both fighters only are interested in money....not great fighters on anyone's list

Also I think Mayweather is very dirty and that this fight if it does happen will end in controversy, bitten ear, or some other foul.....followed by a rematch and another one

The fight fans are the ultimate losers to watch these flimflam pugilists

Surprised you haven't coughed up for a bigger TV though.....

Edited by tailspin, 2011-11-15 01:57:18.

[tropo]

tailspin, on 2011-11-15 01:54:00, said:

the great waffle master is back...first you had marquez ahead on "points", then you claim to have not really seen the fight due to an obstructed view but still saw enough to make a decision....was your scoring based on the 10 point must system?  why not post the scores here for our evaluation.....next thing you will tell us that you didn't really  see the fight but know someone who knows someone....etcetcetc.....haven't seen such backpedalling since...well Marquez.....a bit like an Italian Tank in ww2....2 forward speeds and 6 reverse....

What do you mean I'm back? You really need to concentrate. I wrote that reply straight after the fight about 36 hours ago.

Now why don't you go away and play expert somewhere else or just quit your ridiculous baiting.

Edited by tropo, 2011-11-15 02:21:40.

[cdnvic]

Deleted a personal argument that was derailing the topic.

[chicagogato]

tropo, on 2011-11-14 00:24:29, said:

bhatmasterson, on 2011-11-13 18:01:26, said:

This Pacman gets the daylights beaten out of him by Mayweather!

Do you mean Mayweather will finally have the courage to face him? If people think the way you do, the value of that fight will have diminished significantly and Money Mayweather will be making a lot less money.

Pacquiao vs Mayweather has always had "snoozefest" written all over it.

The value of the fight everyone wants to see has already been "diminished significantly" and Mayweather had nothing to do with it. But people will still buy it for different reasons.

This fight proves one things, Manny has not evolved into this great elite fighter. He was just protected and well matched up. I really don't think a Manny/Mayweather fight is going to happen until Bob Arum says it's okay.

You feel Money is scared of Pac. Okay. Thats your opinion. But Manny and Top Rank's game got exposed, simple as that.

So,you can predict the future now? That makes sense since you seem to know how Manny feels and what he thinks at any given time. May will make a lot less money? Guess you will have to just wait and see. It's not your money. Why bother about it?

"Pacquiao vs Mayweather has always had "snoozefest" written all over it." You think it will be a snooze fest but that won't stop it from being one of the biggest fights to date.

[RKeith]

tropo, on 2011-11-15 02:21:15, said:

  

Now why don't you go away and play expert somewhere else or just quit your ridiculous baiting.

I second this.    

Edited by RKeith, 2011-11-15 08:59:57.

[tropo]

chicagogato, on 2011-11-15 07:20:50, said:

tropo, on 2011-11-14 00:24:29, said:

bhatmasterson, on 2011-11-13 18:01:26, said:

This Pacman gets the daylights beaten out of him by Mayweather!

Do you mean Mayweather will finally have the courage to face him? If people think the way you do, the value of that fight will have diminished significantly and Money Mayweather will be making a lot less money.

Pacquiao vs Mayweather has always had "snoozefest" written all over it.

The value of the fight everyone wants to see has already been "diminished significantly" and Mayweather had nothing to do with it. But people will still buy it for different reasons.

This fight proves one things, Manny has not evolved into this great elite fighter. He was just protected and well matched up. I really don't think a Manny/Mayweather fight is going to happen until Bob Arum says it's okay.

You feel Money is scared of Pac. Okay. Thats your opinion. But Manny and Top Rank's game got exposed, simple as that.

So,you can predict the future now? That makes sense since you seem to know how Manny feels and what he thinks at any given time. May will make a lot less money? Guess you will have to just wait and see. It's not your money. Why bother about it?

"Pacquiao vs Mayweather has always had "snoozefest" written all over it." You think it will be a snooze fest but that won't stop it from being one of the biggest fights to date.

Have you taken over where Tailspin left off?

Allow me to clarify a few points that should have been obvious:

1. They were my opinions only. I cannot read the future.

2. Yes, despite Pacquiao vs Mayweather having "snoozefest written all over it" people will still buy it.

3. I believe Mayweather WAS scared of Pacquiao, but not now.  

You must understand that fighters are human and can have off days.  

You seem to think Pacquiao's career is all part of an elaborate game with Top Rank in control. I'm surprised you didn't forward the theory that maybe Pacquiao played down his skills to lure Mayweather out of hiding? Perhaps you think the judges were paid off?