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[rak sa_ngop]

marios, on 2010-06-21 11:50:44, said:

Has anybody any experience with acupuncture in the treatment of tinnitus? (buzzing in the ears)

I suffered from 'buzzing in the ears' for about 6 months, I think it was more of a stress-related, anxiety problem (coupled with too much Saeng Som) caused by my house sale in the UK (3 buyers over 9 months, one who was arrested by the fraud squad).

Anyway after the house sale went through the symptons persisted so I visited the St Louis Hospital Chinese Medecine clinic. First session was 850 baht, but following sessions were 600 baht each. I was recommended to have 8 sessions, in the end I had 12.

Difficult to say if it was the acupuncture or just the action of time, but the symptons subsided eventually to a manageable level (i.e. I don't wake up with the buzzing, but if I think about it I can still detect it).

Anyway I think it is well worth trying, the staff at St Louis are very pleasant and the doctor (Chinese) instilled confidence and optimism.

Good luck

[marios]

rak sa_ngop, on 2010-07-06 12:49:59, said:

marios, on 2010-06-21 11:50:44, said:

Has anybody any experience with acupuncture in the treatment of tinnitus? (buzzing in the ears)

I suffered from 'buzzing in the ears' for about 6 months, I think it was more of a stress-related, anxiety problem (coupled with too much Saeng Som) caused by my house sale in the UK (3 buyers over 9 months, one who was arrested by the fraud squad).

Anyway after the house sale went through the symptons persisted so I visited the St Louis Hospital Chinese Medecine clinic. First session was 850 baht, but following sessions were 600 baht each. I was recommended to have 8 sessions, in the end I had 12.

Difficult to say if it was the acupuncture or just the action of time, but the symptons subsided eventually to a manageable level (i.e. I don't wake up with the buzzing, but if I think about it I can still detect it).

Anyway I think it is well worth trying, the staff at St Louis are very pleasant and the doctor (Chinese) instilled confidence and optimism.

Good luck

This is superb news my friend.

I am aware of the TCM clinic at Saint Louis and I am also aware that they offer treatment for tinnitus in their page.
In fact I called a number of times and an English speaking nurse could n't really assure me that they will cure my wife. Anyway I am coming to Bangkok on the 5th Sept. and we will  most certainly go there. Thank you again for this info. It is so good to have a hope, even a slim one.
Take care

Mario

[vikik]

marios, on 2010-08-22 20:55:22, said:

rak sa_ngop, on 2010-07-06 12:49:59, said:

marios, on 2010-06-21 11:50:44, said:

Has anybody any experience with acupuncture in the treatment of tinnitus? (buzzing in the ears)

I suffered from 'buzzing in the ears' for about 6 months, I think it was more of a stress-related, anxiety problem (coupled with too much Saeng Som) caused by my house sale in the UK (3 buyers over 9 months, one who was arrested by the fraud squad).

Anyway after the house sale went through the symptons persisted so I visited the St Louis Hospital Chinese Medecine clinic. First session was 850 baht, but following sessions were 600 baht each. I was recommended to have 8 sessions, in the end I had 12.

Difficult to say if it was the acupuncture or just the action of time, but the symptons subsided eventually to a manageable level (i.e. I don't wake up with the buzzing, but if I think about it I can still detect it).

Anyway I think it is well worth trying, the staff at St Louis are very pleasant and the doctor (Chinese) instilled confidence and optimism.

Good luck

This is superb news my friend.

I am aware of the TCM clinic at Saint Louis and I am also aware that they offer treatment for tinnitus in their page.
In fact I called a number of times and an English speaking nurse could n't really assure me that they will cure my wife. Anyway I am coming to Bangkok on the 5th Sept. and we will  most certainly go there. Thank you again for this info. It is so good to have a hope, even a slim one.
Take care

Mario

I'm an Acupuncturist so can't help chiming in here. Tinnitus is very difficult to cure with any medicine so they have done well (and probably time away from UK too). Some illnesses which take a long time to develop also take time to reverse. Sometimes you can only stop them from getting worse. At least with Chinese medicine they treat the whole system so many other side complaints maybe alleviated even if the worst one is a bit more stubborn...

[marios]

vikik, on 2010-11-02 05:32:39, said:

marios, on 2010-08-22 20:55:22, said:

rak sa_ngop, on 2010-07-06 12:49:59, said:

marios, on 2010-06-21 11:50:44, said:

Has anybody any experience with acupuncture in the treatment of tinnitus? (buzzing in the ears)

I suffered from 'buzzing in the ears' for about 6 months, I think it was more of a stress-related, anxiety problem (coupled with too much Saeng Som) caused by my house sale in the UK (3 buyers over 9 months, one who was arrested by the fraud squad).

Anyway after the house sale went through the symptons persisted so I visited the St Louis Hospital Chinese Medecine clinic. First session was 850 baht, but following sessions were 600 baht each. I was recommended to have 8 sessions, in the end I had 12.

Difficult to say if it was the acupuncture or just the action of time, but the symptons subsided eventually to a manageable level (i.e. I don't wake up with the buzzing, but if I think about it I can still detect it).

Anyway I think it is well worth trying, the staff at St Louis are very pleasant and the doctor (Chinese) instilled confidence and optimism.

Good luck

This is superb news my friend.

I am aware of the TCM clinic at Saint Louis and I am also aware that they offer treatment for tinnitus in their page.
In fact I called a number of times and an English speaking nurse could n't really assure me that they will cure my wife. Anyway I am coming to Bangkok on the 5th Sept. and we will  most certainly go there. Thank you again for this info. It is so good to have a hope, even a slim one.
Take care

Mario

I'm an Acupuncturist so can't help chiming in here. Tinnitus is very difficult to cure with any medicine so they have done well (and probably time away from UK too). Some illnesses which take a long time to develop also take time to reverse. Sometimes you can only stop them from getting worse. At least with Chinese medicine they treat the whole system so many other side complaints maybe alleviated even if the worst one is a bit more stubborn...

I have in fact come to Bangkok early September and spent one month there. I took my wife (suffering from tinnitus) to Saint Louis Hospital Chinese Clinic. After the second treatment, the tinnitus in her right ear has disappeared. Sadly though, the buzzing in her left ear persisted but with less intensity. I do not understand the mechanics of acupuncture so I cannot tell why was that. However,  irrespective of the cruel irony of the cure of only one ear, one cannot dismiss acupuncture because it did  cure something. Furthermore he cured my wifes big toe which had lost tone and sensation through acupucture.
Bottom line, for a modest fee, at a place which is not overcrowded yet, one may have a chance for chronic, persistent maladies where western medicine cannot help.

regards

Mario

[Gers1873]

Just wondering -  as the number of Koreans in Thailand is on the increase, especially around manufacturing areas - such as Sri Racha.  

Has anyone heard if or used Korean acupuncturists?

By all accounts the techniques are different from the Chinese treatments.  Always ready to listen to opinions of others.

[Hermes100]

Please see james rhandi on youtube on this subject.
In my opinion, and that of vitualy all other's who have investigated this subject it is another complete fraud.
I would respectfully ask anyone to see this true evidence and then say that they refute it.
Please bear in mind that if one's takes it and feel's better it does not in any way prove- anything.
What has been proven is even in china it is used a suggestive medicine. in other words, top doctors at beijing say ( as they did to Rhandi " we know its fake, but it is cheap, and keeps people quiet")
Rather like horrorscope's ,etc. ( I would most definatly put all relgion's under this too)

[bunnaag]

Hermes100, on 2011-02-22 19:39:04, said:

Please see james rhandi on youtube on this subject.
In my opinion, and that of vitualy all other's who have investigated this subject it is another complete fraud.
I would respectfully ask anyone to see this true evidence and then say that they refute it.
Please bear in mind that if one's takes it and feel's better it does not in any way prove- anything.
What has been proven is even in china it is used a suggestive medicine. in other words, top doctors at beijing say ( as they did to Rhandi " we know its fake, but it is cheap, and keeps people quiet")
Rather like horrorscope's ,etc. ( I would most definatly put all relgion's under this too)

I do not think top doctors in Beijing say it is a fraud.Please name some.However they admit they do not know  why in many cases ,especially when pain is treated,it works.Some are of the opinion it is a placebo effect.

[Deeral]

THere is a prolifertion of quack medicines in Thailand - those seeking such treatments as Acupuncture, Homeopathy and Chiropractic etc should research the scientific evidence into these which shows quite clearly that they are based on fallacious concepts and simply don't work.

[Bagwan]

Deeral, on 2011-03-01 13:46:16, said:

THere is a prolifertion of quack medicines in Thailand - those seeking such treatments as Acupuncture, Homeopathy and Chiropractic etc should research the scientific evidence into these which shows quite clearly that they are based on fallacious concepts and simply don't work.

I am not in complete agreement. It is totally unproductive for those who think that alternative medicines actually work to decry a more scientific approach and vice versa. Such inflexibility in both camps prevents us moving forward in our understandings. Many of todays drugs are distillations from old native remedies so it would be unwise to write off what may be considered by some as old wives tales.

Follow the link below it is very interesting.

http://www.open2.net...pies/index.html


I am particularly taken with the idea that the mind can overtake many ailments. Take as an example seasickness.  I have seen about half of a ship's company reduced to a state of misery during North Atlantic gales and a South China Sea typhoon. When asked by members of my Mess to what I attributed my immunity I said that I had convinced myself that the blood of Drake,Raleigh, Nelson and other great British naval heroes coursed through my veins and the notion of falling victim to a heavy sea was a total nonsense. I added that if the Russians or Chinese came over the horizon and started to lob large quantities of high explosive in our direction they'd soon forget about self indulgence and their training and drill would take over. Quite a few found that that thought gave them relief.  

Talking with my doctor who specialises in critical care I said there must have been many times when she went off duty that she thought that a patient would have been relocated to the morgue before her next duty period, and she agreed. Some have a very strong will to survive that overcomes bad situations and medical science cannot explain this. Consider the effect of a placebo. Very often the unknowing patient believes that they are now going to get better and for no good medical reason they do. It seems that the relationship with whomsoever is treating them is a significant factor in their recovery. If somebody thinks that an ancient Chinese remedy will cure them they may recover but whether the remedy can take the credit is another matter entirely.

Some may swear by acupuncture but I am not one of that number.  For a while I suffered lower back pain and the Royal Orthopaedic Hospital in the UK could find no physical cause, and apparently this is quite common. I was told that they had run out of ideas for any treatment and thought that the condition would eventually go away. I could either ignore the discomfort and pain in which case relief would occur sooner or sit around and moan in which case it would take much longer. Strength of m ind at work again? I consulted a Californian guy here in Pattaya who stuck needles in me on about a dozen occasions but to no avail. To be honest I didn't have a great deal of confidence in him or acupuncture. Soon afterwards a nice professional masseuse who had completed a two year course at Wat Pho cured me. She said that it would take about 8 weekly treatments and if I wasn't better after 10 then any extra treatment would be free of charge. I had confidence in her and the miracle occurred and have never had a problem since.


In the matter of quack medicines in general I believe that there are a lot of quack doctors around also. My wife and I consult with four doctors in whom we have total confidence and I believe it is no coincidence that three of them are female. The other is French.

[Deeral]

Your comments on this are completely without logic and unfortunately I haven't got time to show you how. But this is not a question of flexibility...it is pure and simple incontrovertible evidence - anecdotal evidence you cite is actually worthless as it is not verifiable or repeatable.

If I get time - and the inclination I'll get back to you, but in the meantime you really should familiarise yourself with how "medicines" and treatments are PROVED to be effective.

[Deeral]

Still short on time for this but one phrase really underlines the whole problem
" Such inflexibility in both camps " - there AREN"T 2 camps.
With medicine there is only one camp - the "does it work" camp.
any medicine or treatment needs to be proven - the ways to do this are not political or based on anything but pure logic - time and again treaments such as homeopathy, acupuncture, chiropractic have been tested and shown to show no efficacy other than placebo.
If you can find another camp then do tell\

[Travelish]

the problem is that most acupuncturists only treat the symptoms and not the origin of the disease.
The only good acupuncturist is the one that advises  food as medicine, that is the real TCM.

[piki]

There's a korean doctor in Thonglo. He does very good acupuncture and other therapy.
Most of his patients come from oversea: china, taiwan, hongkong, indonesia, europe, korea etc
His address: 8th floor, Panjit Tower, Thonglo (sukhumvit 55)
It's next to Somerset Residence.
Telephone number:
027126861, 0819926642
Dr Lee

[radiola]

Kit jawet clinic

    Thaiacupunture.com

    Silom/Sathorn area

    Perfect english ..

    With 2000 THB gives you,  acupunture, hipnosis, personalized meditation and reiki…all inclusive.



PERFECT ENGLISH?????   This guy has the worse english ever, even local fruit seler has better english, and when he starts to talk, you only understand him 30%

I had to spell him the symptom, even then he did not understand and called another person. When he told me about the cost I said it is too expensive and he said something, mumbling in the phone and disconnected the phone

bad experience, will not go near this place

[fullwhenempty]

Deeral, on 2011-03-16 22:21:27, said:

With medicine there is only one camp - the "does it work" camp.

Quite agree. That's why millions are seeking alternatives.

How do you define 'work'? If you want your condition managed, then pills 'work'. If you seek a cure, then they don't.

Quote

any medicine or treatment needs to be proven - the ways to do this are not political or based on anything but pure logic

Nonsense. It's impossible to test many treatments. As to your 'proof', even the Orthodox Doctors have little confidence..

'Why Most Published Research Findings Are False'

http://www.plosmedic...al.pmed.0020124

Quote

time and again treaments such as homeopathy, acupuncture, chiropractic have been tested and shown to show no efficacy other than placebo.

Then don't use them.

Have you researched the evidence from within those industries or only from an industry that has a history of crushing or rubbishing all competition? Or have you just been reading 'Quackwatch'?  The fact is, some of these methods are supported by national governments and even if, at a minimum, they only work via 'Placebo', they still work. Which should be okay with you since you said  'there is only one camp - the "does it work" camp'.    

Several members have reported positive results for Acupuncture. Including a friend of mine who was cured of Bell's Palsy. I also know people who have been helped by Chiro. Are you seriously suggesting it was 'all in the mind'?

I can accept what you say, to a certain extent, but in a different context. There are thousands of practitioners who are making a living taking one narrow aspect of a total healing system... like Traditional Chinese medicine, or Ayurveda... and becoming proficient in it. They have limited success, simply because it's not the whole system. But this is no different than going to your Doctor, receiving your shiney pill, then expecting it to help you, even though you carry on eating junk food and flopping on the couch. You don't just need the pill. You need the other lifestyle changes, too.

When it comes to the burden of proof, you appear to have a complete lack of understanding of how natural systems of healing work.

The Scientific model of 'proof' is generally dependent on one drug and one symptom, which can be modelled in a lab. Results are often biased and exaggerated (the difference between 'Relative' and 'Absolute' benefit). Traditional systems cannot be tested 'scientifically' because the one symptom-one drug model DOES NOT APPLY.

If I take a herbal remedy that has 20 or 30 herbs, all of which have multiple effects, how do I know which herb created which effect? If you then augment those herbs with stress management, hydrotherapy, acupuncture, massage, proper nutrition, Reiki, exercise, belief in a higher power and so on PLUS factor in the unique nature of the patient and the high chance of misdiagnosis, how on earth can you test what worked scientifically? It's impossible. There are far too many variables. You can monitor blood sugar, cholesterol, pain and other measures, which practitioners do.

Traditional systems HAVE been tested over thousands of years. It's called 'Trial and Error'.  The same Trial and Error that Psychiatry uses. Have you ever seen a test for a lack of Serotonin? How about a test for the chemical imbalance in the brain? Ever seen one? No. So what does that say for scientific proof?

No two natural Doctors have the same methods and no two patients are alike. You simply cannot test this. Advocates and zealots of the Western model, use this to deceive. They can trot out the charge that 'there is no proof' and this is true. What they don't say is that proof is impossible. They then shut off any escape by saying 'Anecdotal evidence is not proof'. Thus, Natural medicine is placed in an impossible position.  

This is clearly unfair and I think most of the public are tired of such negative tactics.

[MissesGrin]

I've always been curious about acupuncture but just the thought of pins and needles make me nervous. I don't even like getting shots, what more intentionally putting hundreds of pins into my skin.

[ashleygreer]

I came to know about this hospital. Refer this link http://www.bangkokho...en/acupuncture. May be it is useful for you.

[pumpum]

The acupuncturist at Kit Jawet is awesome and really helped me with my migraines. He is an older fellow - in his 70s - and no frills but what I would consider a master. He is also funny and has a nice bedside manner.

[pumpum]

PERFECT ENGLISH????? This guy has the worse english ever, even local fruit seler has better english, and when he starts to talk, you only understand him 30%

I had to spell him the symptom, even then he did not understand and called another person. When he told me about the cost I said it is too expensive and he said something, mumbling in the phone and disconnected the phone

bad experience, will not go near this place


You really missed out because, though his English isn't great (he is in his late 70s, cut him a break!), he is an absolute master and did, in two sessions, what it took my very experienced acupuncturist in the east coast of the United States, EIGHT WEEKS to do. If you would have listened a bit harder and been more polite, you may have understood that the reason he is more expensive, is because he cures the problems very quickly, with few visits, and still has to pay the rent.

[radiola]

pumpum, on 2012-02-06 17:41:51, said:

PERFECT ENGLISH????? This guy has the worse english ever, even local fruit seler has better english, and when he starts to talk, you only understand him 30%

I had to spell him the symptom, even then he did not understand and called another person. When he told me about the cost I said it is too expensive and he said something, mumbling in the phone and disconnected the phone

bad experience, will not go near this place


You really missed out because, though his English isn't great (he is in his late 70s, cut him a break!), he is an absolute master and did, in two sessions, what it took my very experienced acupuncturist in the east coast of the United States, EIGHT WEEKS to do. If you would have listened a bit harder and been more polite, you may have understood that the reason he is more expensive, is because he cures the problems very quickly, with few visits, and still has to pay the rent.

sorry i do not believe that. He charges like 2000 per hour or something. Is his rent 40000 per month? I doubt it, if yes he can move to cheaper place.

I doubt there is much difference in acupuncuturists schooled in China, i think this guy is thai.

I used 2 chinese doctors, i have some improvement, not 100 % but still it helped a bit.

I doubt this guy is more masterful then other chonese docs working in bkk

[pumpum]

Radiola, you did not understand what I said.

He treats you very quickly and he explained to me that he charges a bit more because otherwise he would go broke...how is that so hard to understand? If he sees a patient two or three times he has to charge more than the folks who see them eight or ten times. Business-wise, it makes perfect sense to me.

Yes, you heard me correctly. He sees people for an average of TWO TO THREE SESSIONS before they get releif, in many cases. You can go somewhere else and pay a bit less but you will potentially be back for treatments for several weeks. Like I said, I went to a top acu in the east coast US and it took eight or ten weeks of going twice a week for her to control my migraines and migraine triggers. That is not unusual either, it is the normal length of time at most places. This guy, however, got me similar results in TWO TREATMENTS. And the proof is in the pudding because I can now expose myself to my usual food triggers and not have to run home from work puking my guts out with a screaming headache.

So, besides the fact that he is good, it is a better value all round. I am perfectly willing to pay 2,000 an hour to go twice rather than pay 1,000 to go eight or ten times. How can this not be clear to you?

Also he is indeed Chinese trained, though he is Thai. Why is that so hard to believe?

[pumpum]

Also, he never claimed to or did give me hypnosis so I have no idea where you came upon that idea.