280 replies to this topic
Posted 2006-09-20 15:58:04
Respect blam ! This is a perfect sum'up of the situation. Bravo.
 blam, on 2006-09-20 14:54:47, said:
Thailand before Thaksin? Does anyone remember?
Thaksin has destroyed this country. Fascism in the name of progress. What we see now is a ghost, or just a shell, of what Thailand was 10 years ago. Thaksin's form of democracy made democracy into a terrible thing; absolute power corrupts absolutely. There was no real democracy at all, the 'landslide' votes were generated by a fantastically well financed and organized roots level money distribution and propaganda machine.
Posted 2006-09-20 16:13:50
Saraburi soldiers head for Bangkok
A military source said 15 trucks of fully-armed soldiers from the Pawai Camp are heading to Bangkok Wednesday afternoon.
The source said the trucks left the camp at 3 pm.
Source: The Nation - 20 September 2006
Posted 2006-09-20 16:15:17
I was talking to her Dad also, and he said it was on TV.
Don't think any 'porkies' involved.
Thanks.
Posted 2006-09-20 16:19:37
Tour operators in Khaosan believe the national situation will improve
The Association of Tourism Business Operators in Khaosan Road views that the military coup will benefit Thailand’s political system and tourism industry in the future.
Mr. Prayuth Singhdamrong, the board member of this association, revealed that the Administrative Reform Committee under the Constitutional Monarchy’s occupation of the government will help clarify the political and tourism situations in the country. He has considered this movement as a positive sign. He said foreign tourists who reside in Khaosan Road have not been affected from the coup, and they are not worried about the situation. They have confirmed that they will not return to their countries as they believe the situation will escalate to violence.
Meanwhile, a Canadian tourist said that the pictures taken by foreign press members are too violent, and he has asked to take a photo with Thailand’s military members who are willingly to cooperate with him.
Source: Thai National News Bureau Public Relations Department - 20 September 2006
Posted 2006-09-20 16:29:51
Jai Dee, on 2006-09-20 16:19:37, said: They have confirmed that they will not return to their countries as they believe the situation will escalate to violence.
Source: Thai National News Bureau Public Relations Department - 20 September 2006
Quite the unfortunate typo!
Posted 2006-09-20 16:40:33
blam, on 2006-09-20 08:54:47, said: My first visit here was over 25 years ago, and I have lived here most of the time now for the last 20 years; 19 years in the North, now in Phuket. I am proud to say that I have given this country and local communities far more than I have ever taken.
Thailand before Thaksin? Does anyone remember?
Thaksin has destroyed this country. Fascism in the name of progress. What we see now is a ghost, or just a shell, of what Thailand was 10 years ago. Thaksin's form of democracy made democracy into a terrible thing; absolute power corrupts absolutely. There was no real democracy at all, the 'landslide' votes were generated by a fantastically well financed and organized roots level money distribution and propaganda machine.
Someone mentioned that the coup, and the lead up to it, were financed by the alcohol and tobacco industries. Of course they were just an example of those who were opposed to the TRT, BUT the sheer amounts of corruption by Thai Rak Thai, and the amount of uncontestable control mongering, became simply astounding, overwhelming, and impossible to ignore. I'm talking about the sheer amounts of money generated, and accrued, by the fellow school classmates of Thaksin, his cabinet members, the TRT party heads, Thaksin's family,and the Thai/Chinese community in general, it is completely beyond belief, and actually had become illegal to question. The rich get so rich that they can pay the poor to vote for them and carry their flag, it's just that simple.
These guys that pulled the transition: They knew what they were doing, they knew who would support them, and it seems to me today that they realized how to do it in the least harmful way. They did their homework and the timing was perfect. There is huge public support at the moment.
I for one, as a very long term Thailand resident, hope that the Thaksin years will become a distant reminder of how someone can corruptively control not just government, but basically everything, to generate even more wealth and power... if he has enough money to pay for it. It's an old story throughout history of course. This time it's our legacy to repair.
I admire the people that finally stood up to say, 'I've had enough and I can't take it any more!" A totally corrupt democracy is not a democracy at all. If someone has anything to say about that, I will just say that you haven't lived here in Prathet Thai long enough to know what you are talking about. Thailand WILL become a better place. Mark my words. Fear not, the road to true democracy has begun.
'Old and in the way' in Phuket
blam-
You speak well. I remember Thailand before Thaksin aka I-pay-no-Taxsin.
This snake has put money in one pocket of the poor and taken from the other pocket.
He has divided the country and I wonder what other scams he had up his sleave ?
He should also be brought to book and pay back some of the money he has stolen from the nation.
How can a policeman from Chiang Mai become a Billionaire ?
How can a crooner on a cruise ship do the same and become Prime Minister of Italy ?
Bloody Good Riddance !
Posted 2006-09-20 16:44:43
blam, on 2006-09-20 15:54:47, said: My first visit here was over 25 years ago, and I have lived here most of the time now for the last 20 years; 19 years in the North, now in Phuket. I am proud to say that I have given this country and local communities far more than I have ever taken.
Thailand before Thaksin? Does anyone remember?
Thaksin has destroyed this country. Fascism in the name of progress. What we see now is a ghost, or just a shell, of what Thailand was 10 years ago. Thaksin's form of democracy made democracy into a terrible thing; absolute power corrupts absolutely. There was no real democracy at all, the 'landslide' votes were generated by a fantastically well financed and organized roots level money distribution and propaganda machine.
Someone mentioned that the coup, and the lead up to it, were financed by the alcohol and tobacco industries. Of course they were just an example of those who were opposed to the TRT, BUT the sheer amounts of corruption by Thai Rak Thai, and the amount of uncontestable control mongering, became simply astounding, overwhelming, and impossible to ignore. I'm talking about the sheer amounts of money generated, and accrued, by the fellow school classmates of Thaksin, his cabinet members, the TRT party heads, Thaksin's family,and the Thai/Chinese community in general, it is completely beyond belief, and actually had become illegal to question. The rich get so rich that they can pay the poor to vote for them and carry their flag, it's just that simple.
These guys that pulled the transition: They knew what they were doing, they knew who would support them, and it seems to me today that they realized how to do it in the least harmful way. They did their homework and the timing was perfect. There is huge public support at the moment.
I for one, as a very long term Thailand resident, hope that the Thaksin years will become a distant reminder of how someone can corruptively control not just government, but basically everything, to generate even more wealth and power... if he has enough money to pay for it. It's an old story throughout history of course. This time it's our legacy to repair.
I admire the people that finally stood up to say, 'I've had enough and I can't take it any more!" A totally corrupt democracy is not a democracy at all. If someone has anything to say about that, I will just say that you haven't lived here in Prathet Thai long enough to know what you are talking about. Thailand WILL become a better place. Mark my words. Fear not, the road to true democracy has begun.
'Old and in the way' in Phuket
Excellent Thoughts and Understanding My Friend,
The reasons given by General Sonthi for the coup http://newsimg.bbc.c...fic/5362332.stm are quite clear and logical.
I hope for a quick resolution of this situation and a swift return to the path of democracy.
Thai Military and Police Commanders - Please note: THE WHOLE WORLD IS WATCHING
Posted 2006-09-20 17:01:25
Quote Coup leader just broadcast saying new pm within 2 weeks, and they will not chase T's assets.
sounds like he will be allowed to take up residence abroad if he wishes and not be held to account for any of the misdeeds and financial juggling he has been accused of.
Edited by taxexile, 2006-09-20 17:02:46.
Posted 2006-09-20 17:11:39
There are reports of violence, on BBC, although the story gets cut, and reverts to one from earlier in the day..
Anyone have any info about this?
Posted 2006-09-20 17:50:39
From the Nation: http://www.nationmul...es_30014111.php
Quote Coup leaders confronted Prin Suwannathat - commander of the First Infantry Division and a classmate of Thaksin during their military academy years.
They asked him: "We have a consensus for a coup. What's your stance?"
Prin reportedly replied: "It's up to all of you."
This is really funny:
General1: Hey, we are doing a coup, what do you think?
General2: Up to you...
Posted 2006-09-20 17:57:05
zink, on 2006-09-20 17:50:39, said: This is really funny:
General1: Hey, we are doing a coup, what do you think?
General2: Up to you...
Well, I would call that : "pragmatism". Good move from General 2.
Posted 2006-09-20 18:51:01
phuketrichard, on 2006-09-20 06:57:25, said: if they want international support then why did they shut out cnn and BBC on ubc>
Soldiers keep close watch on media networks
BANGKOK (The Nation): Around 9 pm last night, before the Administrative Reform Council’s first announcement, soldiers entered Shin Satellite headquarters – the control room for the Thaicom III satellite.
All employees were cleared out.
“I had no idea what happened then. It’s startling,” said a control officer, who anticipated the soldiers could have blocked satellite transmissions.
Hours later, UBC signals broadcast via Thaicom were shut down. At first, there were negotiations to block only news channels – particularly CNN and BBC – but later all channels, including entertainment, were off air. The shut down was still in force at press time.
Thaicom III building on Phaholyothin Rd also houses control facilities for Advanced Info Service, which operates a GSM mobile phone network. It was seized at about 8 pm.
“No soldier went inside the building but we’re terrified, seeing soldiers sur rounding the building like that,” said an AIS employee. “Still, we waited until 11 pm, after learning about the coup and seeing no violence. Then, we headed home.”
AIS services are operating as usual.
There were also reports the Administrative Reform Council (ARC) sought to cut off all mobile phone networks, but operators talked them out of it because of emergency health situations.
Besides former Shin Corp media outlets, now owned by Temasek Holdings of Singapore, the offices of other mass media including Nation Multimedia Group (NMG) have been encircled by troops.
At the office of NMG on Bangna-Trad Rd, 40 soldiers are stationed around the building. They claim to be here to “protect and provide security”. Those wanting to enter or leave the property were required to present identification.
Meanwhile all six free-to-air television channels have suspended their normal programs and are broadcasting songs praising His Majesty the King. There is an occasional broadcast for the ARC.
Channel 11, operated by the Public Relations Department, and iTV returned to normal broadcasts at 8.30 am today.
Brought to you by:
The Phuket Gazette
12:53 local time (GMT +7)
I don't know if this is accurate. I was up until about 1:00AM monitoring the internet and UBC. The news channels were lost, but we never lost any of the other programing.
Posted 2006-09-20 19:12:52
I hate Taksin, but I am always very suspicious of the motives of coup leaders. They usually simply see a good opportunity to increase their own power. In this case, we have been given a good benchmark against which to judge their sincerity.
The coup leaders have promised to handover power to a civilian interim administration within two weeks. If they really do as they promise, I shall be ready to accept that they acted for the good of the country.
A big question: who can they find with the required stature to take control at such a critical juncture? If he was 25 years younger, the obvious candidate would be Prem Tinsulanonda (the prime minister who steered Thailand through the troubles of the 1980s and who everyone agrees was a clean politician). Unfortunately, he was already seen as too old when Thailand needed such a figure 15 years ago. I would be happy to see Anand Panyarachun back in power. He would reassure the investment community and proved able actually to simplify business regulations. Further, he seems to have intelligent ideas about how to start dealing with the problems in the South.
What I fear is some kind of weak figurehead with the generals retaining real power.
Posted 2006-09-20 19:23:09
BritTim, on 2006-09-20 20:12:52, said: The coup leaders have promised to handover power to a civilian interim administration within two weeks. If they really do as they promise, I shall be ready to accept that they acted for the good of the country.
Take a look at history, it has happened before.
Posted 2006-09-20 19:37:31
I have some questions. Links or a new thread would be nice.
1) Where is a complete list of the new rule for Thailand? (New laws)
2) Is there any information if this coup changes the new 90/180 tourist visa law?
3) How does this change other visa requirements non b and so on?
Edited by John K, 2006-09-20 19:38:02.
Posted 2006-09-20 19:39:32
John K, on 2006-09-20 20:37:31, said: I have some questions. Links or a new thread would be nice.
1) Where is a complete list of the new rule for Thailand? (New laws)
Give them time.
Quote 2) Is there any information if this coup changes the new 90/180 tourist visa law?
3) How does this change other visa requirements non b and so on?
I seriously doubt that such inconsequential matters are on the agenda.
Posted 2006-09-20 19:57:21
Quote Take a look at history, it has happened before.
Suchinda didn't relinquish power and lots of people died. Thaksin, btw, got his satellite concession from one of the generals who was with Suchinda, who ousted Chatichai for curruption.
If they hand the government to a hand picked civilian, under what law the new government would operate? They threw the Consitution out already.
Thaksin's gone, good, but at what cost???
Posted 2006-09-20 20:08:27
Jai Dee, on 2006-09-20 16:13:50, said: Saraburi soldiers head for Bangkok
A military source said 15 trucks of fully-armed soldiers from the Pawai Camp are heading to Bangkok Wednesday afternoon.
The source said the trucks left the camp at 3 pm.
Source: The Nation - 20 September 2006
For those of us that live in Bangkok, tonight would be a good night to stay home and let things cool off.
Posted 2006-09-20 22:27:25
I see a lot of knee-jerk reactions against the coup d 'etat in the international press and offical reactions from western "democratic" Govts who cite the damage to Thai "democracy".
From my point of view Taksin had already undermined the democratic institutions and was in the process of attempting of gaining control of the military institution. This is why the military was compelled to act before it was too late.
I am optomistic about the future of Thai democracy.
What these western observers have to understand is that the Thai Military is a check and balance in the Thai political situation. The influence of the royal family is also a check and balance. The Thai political system is different from western systems and this is what these people must try to comprehend.
There are of course risks involved in the transition from military to civilian and then to (hopefully) a democratic political system ... maybe even a stronger democratic system and more mature than previously.
Time will tell.
Posted 2006-09-21 00:49:15
fourbaht, on 2006-09-19 19:58:31, said: Opposition Senator Mechai Viravaidya welcomed Mr Thaksin's departure, despite doubts about the methods used.
"I'm delighted he's gone," he said. "It would have been great if he had resigned voluntarily, but apparently he was too stubborn. But at least it's better than an assassination."
The BBC  Simple and to the point. Applause...!!!
suiging, on 2006-09-19 23:23:38, said: cutter007, on 2006-09-20 13:20:08, said:
So what does everyone think here, will Taksin come back to Thailand anytime soon?
That has got to be one scary experience flying into a country where the entire military is after you.
Specially when you can"t get a taxi and you've lost your golf clubs at the new airport 
I imagine the traffic will be fairly light though, if any taxi driver would even take him.
Posted 2006-09-21 01:29:36
I just received this from my Cambodian contacts:
NEWS FROM CAMBODIA N° 0640-E
Khmemara Jati
Montreal, Quebec
September 20, 2006
We diffuse below an article of the coup in Thailand. This coup d'État is approved by the King and 84 % by the Thais. The population offers flowers to the soldiers. This coup d'État is intended to put an end a corrupt regime which did not manage to solve properly the Moslem rebellion in the Southern of Thailand. The leader of the army who has just made this coup d'État, Sondhi Boonyaratkalin is a Moslem. He is against the hard way using by the discharged Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra to overcome the Moslem rebellion. Thaksin risks now to be prosecuted for corruption.
Pooklook
Senior Member
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Posted 2006-09-21 01:42:24
The baht is amazingly strong even after all the events of the last day. My sense is that the Thai baht is over valued. For it to grow in value 10% against the dollar this year alone to me means that speculative money is keeping it there. I think its better for the currency to reflect the real value to encourage future growth. Even before the overthrow the numbers for growth in many key areas had been downgraded. The change in visa rules can only make the problem worse. The danger of allowing the currency to be improperly valued and the system to be gamed is when the currency speculators pull the money out it can cause a wild swing much like we’ve seen in the gold and silver markets which can lead to long term problems. This seems likely to
continue in the short term as Thailand is at least a year away from elections. I hope that the Land of Smiles will get
someone who really cares instead of yet another CareTAKER…….
Posted 2006-09-21 03:23:26
nikster, on 2006-09-20 06:39:30, said: Charma, on 2006-09-20 06:13:53, said:
TAWP, on 2006-09-20 00:30:09, said:
One could hope they adopted a constitution more like the american, but that will ofcourse never happend...
...but one can dream.
That will be the constitution that got George W elected the first time wouldn't it?
As for Thailand, any country that seems to bear a "casual" military coup which displaces an elected government, no matter how flawed, is a long way from any normal concept of freedom or democracy. What makes anyone think that a general will be better for the people than Taxin? This will set Thailand's hopes to be seen as a modern developed country back at least 10 years. At the moment it's more like a banana republic!
Let's face it, Thailand is not a stable democracy, and never has been. When I first got here a Thai girl told me Thailand was a "democrazy" and that's a more accurate description.
It takes time to build a strong democracy. Thaksin was the most stable democratically elected leader _ever_ in Thailand, remember that. Yet, the man himself had absolutely no respect for democratic principles or the rule of the law - he was a power guy, gunning down "drug suspects" for political ends. He usurped democracy by simply buying out and or threatening political enemies until there were none left. Live by the sword, die by the sword.
Democracy isn't that easy... also, I don't know what would happen in another country - say the president of the U.S.A. goes nuts - there are mechanisms in place that will stop him. He will be impeached etc. If Thailand had a strong judiciary system, that would have happened to Thaksin a long time ago.
merlin: xactly.
If Thailand had a strong judiciary system, Thaksin could never have become PM in the first place!
Well the generals have taken a day off from the golf, good for them. If this is a military junta, I prefer it to western democracy.
...
Posted 2006-09-21 04:29:48
I'm amazed at all the comparisons between Thailand's form of "democracy" and the US's form of "democracy" and the use of the term "democracy" in general
Thailand is a constitutional monarchy. The US is a constitutional republic. They are nothing alike in that respect. They are alike only in that they are both very different than pure democracies.
That said, I hope the best of health and strength for The King and wish for his wisdom and guidance to lead all Thai people in the best direction for their future.
Posted 2006-09-21 06:01:47
Most of Europe, Asia have said the same thing, so lets not single out the Yanks.
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