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[bander]

up2ubar, on 2006-10-16 01:54:23, said:

llothar, on 2006-10-16 00:50:58, said:

up2ubar, on 2006-10-16 00:37:16, said:

Thaddeus, lets just agree to dissagree on the ways i see fit to spend my dollers mate eh!
I really don't want this thread to degenerate into some kind of crazy meaningless flame war.
The purpose of this post was simply to make you fellow expats here aware of the potentially big problem i experienced today!
I am hopefull it may help to ensure other members here don't have to endure a similiar gut wrenching experience to mine!

Maybe she didn't told you anything because anything changed. I know it is absolute forbidden to use an agent for thai immigration forms of any kind. There are huge signs about this on every border checkpoint. And i guess that the other countries here have the same rules.

Hi llothar!

I had/have never had in 3 years any trouble of this nature or anything like it!
The problem here was 100% with the Laos Authorities, Not the Thai's!

Quote

Maybe she didn't told you anything because anything changed.

Not sure if i fully understand that mate!

If you mean:
Maybe she didn't tell me anything as there was nothing to tell, ie no changes

Well for the first time in 3 years i was handed the paperwork & US Dollers to do the donkey work myself! when i asked why she could not do it as always happened in the past she just said "CANNOT"
I can also assure you there was marked change in the attitude of th PDR Laos immigration officials!

Final llother I Can't say i have ever seen a sign referring to Agents at either nong khai or In Laos, not saying tyou are incorrect, merely saying i have not noticed any!

This is typical thai buissiness, she knew whats gone happen on the Laos immigration but didn't want to tell you, why loose 300 thb?
She only lost a good costomer for three years, mai pen rai, tomorrow a new falang coming with $$$.
Good luck with new "honest" thai agent on youe next trip!

[rexall]

Ijustwannateach, on 2006-10-15 23:31:10, said:

But if the form was identical, what did it matter that you filled it out personally or that an agent helped you? Was this simply social discrimination against you for knowing agents? Something seems missing from this story.

Mon 16 Oct 06, 11:18 a.m.

This is slightly off-topic from what you posted here, Ijustwannateach. However, on a similar subject, I have read more than one first-hand account that Thai Immigration in Nong Khai will only accept TM 47 (90 day reporting) forms that are originals (That is not ones downloaded from the internet (eventhough the download is from an official government website, specifically indented to provide forms !!!). And, along with that, it goes without saying that the forms must be filled out by hand, not by computer. I presume this policy extends to other official forms as well.

Go figure!

Aloha,

Rex

[PREM-R]

rexall, on 2006-10-16 11:00:36, said:

My Friend Same, on 2006-10-16 10:36:14, said:

<snip>I have found Laos to be a lot more tourist friendly than Thailand, I don’t get scammed for money by the police and the immigration department in Vientiane are very polite and helpful and will assist you (without a bribe) to obtain both extensions and long term visas to stay in Laos <snip>

Mon 16 Oct 06, 10:54 a.m.

I don't know what those guys are talking about. You go to Laos Immigration window at the Nong Khai border, with your completed application, photo, passport and 1,500 baht, and you get your 15 day visa in 5 min. if you are not traveling during peak hours. If you need a month, you have to go to a Laos Consulate, but that is also quick & easy. The few times I have bee to the Laos Consulate in Khon Kaen, I was the only customer there!

MyFriendSame, could you describe what the long(er)-stay options are for Laos are, fees, procedures, etc.? Thanks, lah!

Aloha,

Rex

Hi Rex,

The visa on arrival for Laos is now valid for 30 days (the same as the visa you get from the consulate). The price has also risen to 35USD or 1700 baht according to reports here on TV.

[stevespiral]

rexall, on 2006-10-16 12:00:36, said:

My Friend Same, on 2006-10-16 10:36:14, said:

<snip>I have found Laos to be a lot more tourist friendly than Thailand, I don’t get scammed for money by the police and the immigration department in Vientiane are very polite and helpful and will assist you (without a bribe) to obtain both extensions and long term visas to stay in Laos <snip>

Mon 16 Oct 06, 10:54 a.m.

I don't know what those guys are talking about. You go to Laos Immigration window at the Nong Khai border, with your completed application, photo, passport and 1,500 baht, and you get your 15 day visa in 5 min. if you are not traveling during peak hours. If you need a month, you have to go to a Laos Consulate, but that is also quick & easy. The few times I have bee to the Laos Consulate in Khon Kaen, I was the only customer there!

MyFriendSame, could you describe what the long(er)-stay options are for Laos are, fees, procedures, etc.? Thanks, lah!

Aloha,

Rex

Hi Rex,
E-mail me directly and i will give you names and numbers of a couple of my Laos Friends who will help you get whatever visa or extention you want, but it might cost you a few nights out on the piss with them, cheap enough tho when a big bottle of beer is 20-40 baht.
Basically the best way to go if you intend on staying in laos a while is to get a work permit which will allow you stay for a year without leaving if you wish. All up it will cost you about 20,000 Baht and will allow you to work there to support yourself.
Cheers,
Steve

[rexall]

zakk9, on 2006-10-16 10:04:32, said:

What's your problem? You are supposed to fill the forms in yourself. If you don't, you may or may not get caught. Yes, the officials can be harsh sometimes, when you brake or bend the rules. If they weren't, they wouldn't get much attention, would they?

Mon 16 Oct 06, 11:43 a.m.

"What's your problem" is a rather condescending remark. Unless specifically warned, what person in their right mind would imagine it made a difference who filled in the ###### form?

Aloha,

Rex

[Happy Jack]

Thaddeus, on 2006-10-15 23:42:34, said:

Why use a Visa agent..... in this example you have been doing all the work for three years anyway, all they did was hold you hand.

I'll do that, sounds like an easy job...... do you think they could get me a work permit for that?

I've only done the Friendship Bridge visa run once (having all my money ripped off in Vientiane put me off going back) but I too used an agent after being turned back at the border the first time for some reason I was unable/not meant to comprehend. This may or may not have been contrived as part of a deal with the agents. Since then I stayed up north and used Mae Sai - where I've never seen any agents operating - other than the inevitable swarms of tourguides.

Anyway, regardless of this the circa 300 baht fee (which sounds right by my recollection) mentioned seems like money well spend in the hassle it saves - and I'd probably happily spend the same money even at Mae Sai where a border run seems considerably easier just to save standing in line and having to deal with customs myself.

So yeah, if you want to take this up as a career then I'd pay you! Of course that might only be 300 baht once every six months or more now that the monthly border run is a no go - so hope you like rice soup.

[Hua-lan]

My Thai girlfriend and I just returned from Vientiane last Friday. The first thing we noticed was that the entry visa had changed from US $30 to US $42 for Canadian citizens. OK I thought and paid extra US$12.00 . A 10 baht fee to enter the country. No problem. Then the swarm of Tuk Tuk drivers charging 250 baht for a ride to the Thai Consulate. We asked the locals and were told they paid 40 Baht. Again, Ferang tax, no big deal.

While touring Vientiane on our rented motorcylce we were also stopped by police for "travelling on a road closed to traffic" after 10PM. The policeman was drunk, and he walked around the motorcyle a few times before asking for our passports. We were smart enough (or maybe stupid enough) to have left them at the hotel we were staying at. Maybe this saved us from a "fine". All I know is that after considering what his colateral might have been, he let us go.

The rest our stay in Vientiane was enjoyable. Visiting the sites, eating at local restaurants, etc. etc.
I had to wait 3 days but had no problems receiving a 60 day tourist Visa for 1000 baht.

Now for our border experience.

We decided to take a Tuk Tuk to the border to return home by train. After negtiating a fair price for a Ferang and his girlfriend, we headed to the checkpoint. When we arrived, I paid the driver, only for him to scream at me that I was a robber, and he pulled out a "rate card" from under his seat that had the price of $25.00 to the checkpont, and not the 40 baht each we negotiated. I refused, and I was also stupid, raising a scene, asking to speak to someone to help us get away from the freak. He followed us in line past the check points. We were allowed to exit the country until at the end, an immigration official asked me to hand him my passport. He then escorted us into a small office and told us to pay the man what we owed him. I argued that he was a theif. It was not about the money, it was about being cheated that was making us angry (and I must admit the attitude of the TUkTuk driver was fueling my rage. ) We waited to hear from a head official who ofcourse told us to pay or go to jail. We paid.

If your going to Laos, avoid the Tuk TUks, take a tour bus if you can, and rent a motorcyle for 350 baht instead. ...

[rexall]

hanuman1, on 2006-10-16 00:46:31, said:

Hi everyone I just got back from Laos yesterday and can confirm what's going on at the border. A Tuk-Tuk driver in Nong Khai told me that all visa agents had been shut down for the time being, so he took me straight to the bridge where i did the paperwork myself <snip>

Mon 16 Oct 06, 11:56 a.m.

Hi Hanuman1, all,

Just a reminder that the Thai-Lao bus from Udon or Nong Khai is whey kewl! You have to get your visa in advance from a Laos Consulate, but it ends up being much cheaper and easier that fooling around with tuk-tuks to the border and then into Vientiane. Big, comfortable coach, only 85 bahtski, drops you off to walk out of Thailand-enter Laos, and then takes you all the way into Vientiane. ==>

Thai-Lao Bus Schedule

Aloha,

Rex

[dantilley]

rexall, on 2006-10-16 10:47:38, said:

Also, any newbies, do not confuse what Up2ubar is describing with an "agent" who actually crosses the border and gets your passport stamped in your place. That is much less common these days, is very illegal, and could result in serious consequences given the current climate immigration enforcement.

Are those operations still running? I can't imagine anyone would be stupid enough to use their services in the current climate!

[kiwiTV]

up2ubar, on 2006-10-15 23:20:55, said:

Had a very tricky 30 minutes or so today whilst on my Nong Khai - Laos Friendship Bridge visa run !

...

I genuinly had no idea anything had changed re using services such as these!

Does anybody have any further information or had the same experience of late?

I think this sort of situation isn't uncommon. There is presently a visa run company from BKK who will only go to Poipet as the immigration officers at Ban Laem haven't been able to settle on a deal there as yet.
They expected it to be righted in a week or two.

Peter

[rexall]

Hua-lan, on 2006-10-16 11:59:35, said:

We decided to take a Tuk Tuk to the border to return home by train. After negotiating a fair price for a Ferang and his girlfriend, we headed to the checkpoint. When we arrived, I paid the driver, only for him to scream at me that I was a robber, and he pulled out a "rate card" from under his seat that had the price of $25.00 to the checkpont, and not the 40 baht each we negotiated. r 350 baht instead. ...

This is terrible! Worse than that, it doesn't sound like there is any way you could protect yourself. All a tuk-tuk mugger has to do is print a phony fee schedule and have the balls to stick to his story, and you are screwed. And I don't logic would be of much help in pointing out that it would be very unlikely that you would agree to pay the tuk-tuk mafioso $25 as the going rate for a mini-van to the border is only half that!

Geeze!

Aloha,

Rex

Edited by rexall, 2006-10-16 12:26:21.

[tropo]

stevespiral, on 2006-10-16 10:11:54, said:

tropo, on 2006-10-16 10:29:49, said:

I think a lot of punters forget that Laos is a communist state. Personally I'd recommend staying away from Laos and Burma and conduct visa proceedings in Malaysia...with Cambodia as a second choice.

You are clueless.......... I bet you have never been to either Laos or Burma have you??? But yet you offer an opinion. For your information I have found Laos to be a lot more tourist friendly than Thailand, I don’t get scammed for money by the police and the immigration department in Vientiane are very polite and helpful and will assist you (without a bribe) to obtain both extensions and long term visas to stay in Laos (a thing of the past in Thailand). Malaysia is more expensive and a pain in the arse to travel to as the closest Thai embassy to the border is 2 hours traveling. I think you have been watching too much western propaganda on TV about communism…… but then that’s why “democratic” governments say what they do about communism to make SHEEP like you form unfounded opinions. Look how well communism works in Singapore, one of the best standards of living in Asia.

I have a few clues that you've provided:

1. You're a communist.

2. You enjoy visiting Laos and Burma.

3. You're a cheapskate.

[The Snark]

Someone has probably already said it. Thai wife and kid? Not doing the support Thai spouse 1 year gig?

Please feel free to shoot yourself in the foot. May I please have 50 satang for every snivel I have heard that is jerking the system around? I'd like to feel as rich as Toxoid for a while.

By the way, having visa run assistance started getting leaned on in 2000 when you could just send your passport over. Both Thai and Laos have bent over backwards and kissed farang ass for years. What pisses me off is every person who cuts even the slightest corner makes it just a little bit harder on us legits.

I just love going up to some Thai at the window after a few stinky farangs have given him/her crap. It makes them so friendly and helpful.

Edited by The Snark, 2006-10-16 12:49:23.

[midas]

stevespiral you need to get facts straight before you calling someone else clueless !
You cant call Singapore a communist state ! It is a parliamentary republic with an independent judiciary is separated from the executive and the legislature.
I don’t think there ANY ' separation of power ' in Vientiene !

[rob:pee]

I went there 14/9/06 and the agent didnt fill out the form for Lao visa as they usually do. So this isnt new after 1/10.

[hanuman1]

rexall, on 2006-10-16 12:05:01, said:

hanuman1, on 2006-10-16 00:46:31, said:

Hi everyone I just got back from Laos yesterday and can confirm what's going on at the border. A Tuk-Tuk driver in Nong Khai told me that all visa agents had been shut down for the time being, so he took me straight to the bridge where i did the paperwork myself <snip>

Mon 16 Oct 06, 11:56 a.m.

Hi Hanuman1, all,

Just a reminder that the Thai-Lao bus from Udon or Nong Khai is whey kewl! You have to get your visa in advance from a Laos Consulate, but it ends up being much cheaper and easier that fooling around with tuk-tuks to the border and then into Vientiane. Big, comfortable coach, only 85 bahtski, drops you off to walk out of Thailand-enter Laos, and then takes you all the way into Vientiane. ==>

Thai-Lao Bus Schedule

Aloha,

Rex

Hi Rex

I've seen those busses you mentioned but have never known where to get on them. Where is the terminus for them in Udon Thani and Vientiane?

Cheers

Hanuman1

[hanuman1]

rob:pee, on 2006-10-16 12:54:10, said:

I went there 14/9/06 and the agent didnt fill out the form for Lao visa as they usually do. So this isnt new after 1/10.

Hi

My tuk-tuk-driving informant told me that the police only started closing down those visa handling agents since 'Awkpansa' - that's supposed to be 'the end of Buddhist Lent', which happened earlier this month.

regards

H

[threelegcowboy]

All,
Having crossed NK/V boarder round trip twice in two weeks and a hundred times befor that.....I feel qualified to comment on some of this.

I think the Loas see the writting on the wall: Fewer falangs will visit Loas because of boarder crossing for visa runs drying up. The fee increase is an example of this. Now $35 for US and probally 36 on weekends.

When the guy stated he filled out the forms himself he agrivated the officers and they called on the LADY who speaks good english to come down and sort out the problem. They like to look in charge and you sound lucky.

There seems to be less traffic into the Thai consulate and the Loas are probally seeing less money in their pocket as a result. Getting ripped off in Laos is rampant and I think it is getting worse.

The Laos in Thailand are finding tighter restrictions on their passage as well.

Lets blame the overall security by controll nuts as the root cause of these problems. Orders at the top probally caused this tightening and restructuring the payments of tea money has caused problems to filter down to the unsuspecting tourist.

It is by chance that you have no problems........

LLL

[southbot]

Yo Viper. I "hear tell" that that Burma immig check post out on Vict. Point, Myanmar, is open.

I use Big Boat Visa Run there, very nice and safe boat, easy trip...

You could call or email them to clarify the border post.

Contact Khun Vichai, speaks Angkriit pertty good. Tel 081 894 9702. His phone worked last time I called him.

Email at info@visa-tour.com

Viper, on 2006-10-16 10:43:14, said:

Im due to make a run pretty soon at Ranong (Burma). Does anybody here know if the border is open there, and has anyone experienced any recent problems? Am I likely to experience anything different to my previous visits at Ranong?

[rayw]

stevespiral, on 2006-10-16 10:11:54, said:

tropo, on 2006-10-16 10:29:49, said:

I think a lot of punters forget that Laos is a communist state. Personally I'd recommend staying away from Laos and Burma and conduct visa proceedings in Malaysia...with Cambodia as a second choice.

You are clueless.......... I bet you have never been to either Laos or Burma have you??? But yet you offer an opinion. For your information I have found Laos to be a lot more tourist friendly than Thailand, I don’t get scammed for money by the police and the immigration department in Vientiane are very polite and helpful and will assist you (without a bribe) to obtain both extensions and long term visas to stay in Laos (a thing of the past in Thailand). Malaysia is more expensive and a pain in the arse to travel to as the closest Thai embassy to the border is 2 hours traveling. I think you have been watching too much western propaganda on TV about communism…… but then that’s why “democratic” governments say what they do about communism to make SHEEP like you form unfounded opinions. Look how well communism works in Singapore, one of the best standards of living in Asia.

Well said. Slight thread drift but still basically relates to Laos immigration and other comments here.

It also should be noted that it is a common misconception that communism has a monopoly on dictatorships. Correct me if I am wrong but if you do your homework I think you will find there are as many if not more extreme right wing capitalist dictatorships in the world as there are communist ones. Also you can and do have communist democratic governments who get into power in properly constituted and accepted democratic states and still get voted out again too. True democracy means that you should be able to vote for a communist or capitalist government or IMHO better those that follow the middle or third way as both extremes have good things to offer as well as bad. It seems that the old crazy "head in sand" McCarthyism still prevails in many western states, it is sad and pathetic in a modern supposedly educated world.

Having said all that I am not a communist but believe in true democracy. So if the majority in ANY country wanted a communist or socialist or fascist state then they should have the right of self determination to be able to elect such a government (and vote them out the next time if they want too). I am personally a believer in the middle or Clinton's/Blair's 3rd way which generally works well, probably because it tries intelligently to embrace the best of both political extremes. Many aspects of Capitalism and Communism absolutely stink and others are great IMHO so we all should be open minded.

Anyway to get back to the thread topic, I am sure the Laos officials were just doing their job and obviously became suspicious when obvious lies were being told to them. What else could this person have been lying about must have been foremost in the official's mind. So really nothing to do with it being a communist state as US immigration is I have found just as bad if not more so and I don't somehow think they are communist !!.

[johnnyk]

Some have opined that the OP was clueless for using an agent but I don't agree.
The one time I went to Laos the travelers who had agents went to the head of the line and were through real quick while it took me best part of an hour. Depends on when you get there I suppose.
Maybe up2ubar was just in a hurry to get it done.

[rexall]

hanuman1, on 2006-10-16 12:54:36, said:

Hi Rex

I've seen those busses you mentioned but have never known where to get on them. Where is the terminus for them in Udon Thani and Vientiane? Cheers, Hanuman1

Mon 16 Oct 06, 1:29 p.m.


The Vientiane coaches depart from the main bus stations in Nohg Khai and Udon. In Udon, it is the big bus station near Robinson's. There is separate waiting area and ticket counter for the Vientiane busses toward the rear of the bus station. 85 baht all the way to Vientiane. The terminus is the main bus station in Vientiane, but I don't exactly know where that is; I took a taxi directly to my hotel before I had a Chance to get my bearings.

Aloha,

Rex

[Kaojai]

1bigeater56, on 2006-10-16 00:53:07, said:

Do not get troubled, do not worry. Always have a good, honest and decent reply to a harsh word to anyone you deal with. This disarms them and you should always take the wife and kids.

The key word is "honest."Since they obviously knew the one form had been from an agent, why deny it? If he had been honest from the start, the problem would not have escalated.

[Sum Num Na]

Good Post.....

What i dont understand in this forum is: Why do people have to pull all the posts apart and try to either disprove them or start some kind of fight over who knows best in here?

Why cant people just read the posts and thank the person who put them there for doing so?

[hanuman1]

Sum Num Na, on 2006-10-16 13:52:54, said:

Good Post.....

What i dont understand in this forum is: Why do people have to pull all the posts apart and try to either disprove them or start some kind of fight over who knows best in here?

Why cant people just read the posts and thank the person who put them there for doing so?

SumNamNa

I completely agree with you, although your name gives your post a somewhat ironic twist!

H.