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BANGKOK 22 October 2018 10:06
cfrsh91

Thai girlfriend first visitor visa refused - help needed addressing refusal points!

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Hi all,
 
I'm a British citizen based in the UK and in a long-distance relationship with a Thai girl who resides in Bangkok. I've been there a couple of times since we've been together and we decided the next step would be for her to come here for 3-4 weeks on a visitor visa, with a view to getting her a fiancée visa 6-12 months down the line.
 

She recently applied for this and got a rejection based on several criteria, which are shown below. Apologies if certain points of this rejection letter may have been addressed previously but every application is different and I wanted to get some personalised input specifically on my girlfriend's visa rejection letter.

 

She went through a visa agency which her friend had successfully used previously for a UK visitor visa, and I got red flags halfway through the process when they asked for payment for their services before she even had the VFS appointment.

They then advised her to deposit around 80,000 THB into her bank account (which her father had given her in cash at her request) several days before the appointment, as her bank account funds were low (despite the fact I had already agreed and submitted documentation to be her sponsor, and this seemingly being acceptable).

 

She did as suggested and after the appointment at VFS, some further research led us to believe that this could be a cause for rejection (due to being classed as funds parking), as the agency had not advised that we would need to explain where the funds came from (and neither of us have had any previous experience trying to get a visa as complicated as a UK one).

 

She then got the below rejection letter, which indicates this was the first reason for rejection.

 

The second reason was that she stated in her application that she would spend around 100,000 THB on various things on the trip, which is over 13x her monthly disposable income and thus they doubt that she was "seeking entry only for the purpose and duration stated".

 

The third reason given was that her mother would help her pay for the visit, and although her mother's bank statement showed a balance of 683,000 THB, 342,000 TBH of this was cash deposits with no explanation offered and thus they do not believe that "the bank statement accurately reflects your personal circumstances and that the funds shown are genuinely available to you for your exclusive use".

 

Regarding the refusal points, to address them we plan to explain as follows:

 

1) The two deposits of 40,000 THB were actually the amounts that her mother would contribute towards her trip, so are we okay to explain this in her introduction letter, if we include a letter from her mother stating this and where it came from? One of the 40,000 THB actually came from her grandmother's account at her parent's request, although this was family savings - we are planning to include a letter for her Grandma to sign which will confirm this.

 

2) To address the second point regarding the 100,000 THB issue as she had put that this would be the cost of the trip to her.. The English question reads "what is the cost of the trip to you personally?" but she has said that the Thai translation of this question reads along the lines of "how much are you going to use on your trip", which she assumed included the cost of the trip to me as her sponsor also, and therefore gave too large a figure considering the amount she will need to spend will be small.

 

3) Her mother's bank statements having unexplained deposits. The deposits actually came from work that she does selling farm produce at market, although she has no record of this other than that which is recorded in a book which she uses to keep records (so no receipts etc.). Regarding this point, are we okay to draw from this that the main reason this was given for refusal was due to the funds not being available solely for her and to counter this by stating that the funds are now in her bank account?

 

Any advice you guys can offer regarding how to resolve this without resorting to using an agency (who I'm clearly not convinced by whatsoever) would be much appreciated.

 

Happy to attach copies of the letters from her/her mother/grandmother/me if you think it will help shed some light.

 

Thanks

 

 

 

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You seem to be doing the rounds of the forums. :smile:

 

Email me your last sponsor letter and the letters from the three of them and I will try and help.

 

Cheers.

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You do seem to have been given some incorrect advice from and agent, unfortunatley it is very easy to set yourself up as an agent here in Thailand, and there is no regulatory authority to monitor the quality of advice given, or address complaints about agents.

 

Certainly padding accounts can lead to problems, as your girlfriend has found out. 

 

It maybe helpful if you could post the actual refusal notice, redacting any personal details, and then the guys on there could maybe offer suggestions in respect of the actual areas of concern.

 

By all means take up the offer of getting another member to read through the sponsors note, but this is a public forum and your pitfalls, and subsequent remidies, maybe of benefit to others.

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Posted (edited)

I thought (and have read on here) that if the sponsor shows that he has sufficient funds to support the applicants trip than that will suffice? Isn't that the whole point of the sponsor, to show that he can fund the trip? Have even read that if this is the case the applicant doesn't even have to show any funds at all, so doing, this in good faith,  may have well backfired on her?

 

This is clearly a very grey area.

Edited by Pat in Pattaya

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4 hours ago, Pat in Pattaya said:

I thought (and have read on here) that if the sponsor shows that he has sufficient funds to support the applicants trip than that will suffice? Isn't that the whole point of the sponsor, to show that he can fund the trip? Have even read that if this is the case the applicant doesn't even have to show any funds at all, so doing, this in good faith,  may have well backfired on her?

 

This is clearly a very grey area.

Not quite that simple I'm afraid, whilst any sponsor will need to satisfy the ECO that they have sufficient funds to sponsor an applicant, and of course the source of the funds, but they also have to satisfy the ECO that it's appropriate and reasonaable for them to do so.

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3 minutes ago, theoldgit said:

Not quite that simple I'm afraid, whilst any sponsor will need to satisfy the ECO that they have sufficient funds to sponsor an applicant, and of course the source of the funds, but they also have to satisfy the ECO that it's appropriate and reasonaable for them to do so.

Which is why I said it's a  grey area. So the ECO could even question the source of funds from the sponsor?? IMO that is ridiculous, if he has the money then he has the money, we're essentially just talking about him paying fora woman's holiday for heavans sake.

 

Fully take your second point though, if it's just a girlfriend that you haven't been with for too long I suppose in the ECO's mind that would be that the sponsor is either a very generous, deperate man (as well as a handsum one) or something is not all as it seems.

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Isn't also confidence in the applicant returning to Thailand an important factor? 

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4 minutes ago, GarryP said:

Isn't also confidence in the applicant returning to Thailand an important factor? 

Yes, massively.

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Spend an hour or so reading the UK embassy website for Visa application and save yourself some money, no need to pay an agent. I've done it for my girlfriend and my friend girlfriend, happy to help you if you like.

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

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The money is not priority no 1 for immigration. Yes you need to show how she is going to be supported, by proving proof of income from you, bank statements, pension, and have some funds of her own etc, however,  more importantly, you have to convince the people at immigration that she is going to return to Thailand. Does she have a job here, does her family need her here for support, does she own her own house or have assets here compelling her to return. You have to keep in mind that the processing immigration officers at the Embassy are all Thais, there are only a handful of actual farang staff, they don't do the applications. So, from my previous experience, firstly, the Thais working at the embassy do not understand English 100%, so when writing letters use the KISS principle, keep it simple stupid. Your countries biggest fear is that she will scamper once in the country. All countries are the same these days, they are making it more difficult for visa, especially Asian countries.

Good luck.

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5 hours ago, Pat in Pattaya said:

I thought (and have read on here) that if the sponsor shows that he has sufficient funds to support the applicants trip than that will suffice? Isn't that the whole point of the sponsor, to show that he can fund the trip? Have even read that if this is the case the applicant doesn't even have to show any funds at all, so doing, this in good faith,  may have well backfired on her?

 

This is clearly a very grey area.

Totally wrong.

 

What they want to see, is references from employers or accounts if self employed from the applicant. Bank statement showing savings, money going in and out for a least a previous 6 months. The purpose of a sponsor is meant to be a person that can confirm where the Thai person will be staying, the rest falls on the applicant to prove he or she can support themselves while visiting and has all intentions of returning to Thailand and not planning to remain in the UK for purposes of becoming a sex worker, working illegally and not being an economic refugee.

 

This is one part of the British immigration system I completely agree with.

 

 

 

 

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14 minutes ago, DUNROAMIN said:

You have to keep in mind that the processing immigration officers at the Embassy are all Thais, there are only a handful of actual farang staff, they don't do the applications. So, from my previous experience, firstly, the Thais working at the embassy do not understand English 100%, so when writing letters use the KISS principle, keep it simple stupid. Your countries biggest fear is that she will scamper once in the country. All countries are the same these days, they are making it more difficult for visa, especially Asian countries.

Would you be good enough to fill us in on the facts regarding your experience, did you work for the UKVI at the British Embassy?

I always understood that the ECO's were either locally employed Brit's or a few other nationalities, like Australia, or UKVI staff on secondment from the UK, is that not the case? You seem to imply, no you actually claim, that the ECO's are all Thai and that the English staff take no part in the decision making process - are you sure about that?

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1 hour ago, Tigger01 said:

Spend an hour or so reading the UK embassy website for Visa application and save yourself some money, no need to pay an agent. I've done it for my girlfriend and my friend girlfriend, happy to help you if you like.

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

Good advice and kind of you to offer your help to the op,  I did one for my misses followed all the criterea from the website and got one no probs but difference for me was I was here in Thailand and when applying I could show accompaning plane tickets and proof of relationship easily.  

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