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meadish_sweetball

Thai Newspaper Headlines

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Hi guys, this is todays I just realised. I clicked on the link and had a go and realised after that it was not the same as yesterdays. I will have a go at that after.

Anyway, here is todays. Bloody tough 1 methinks...I just put my own spin on it to make it sound more of an English heading.

ชี้เหตุอัปยศถ่วงความเจริญ โค้ชหรั่งยันนัด2ไม่มีเอาคืน

After a disgraceful decision in game 1 coach Rang's plead for rematch is denied.

Again not a literal translation but after reading the story, this is the best I could come up with.

I would love to hear others.

Cheers ITR :o

Game 1 could better be translated as the first leg.

Your right Bannork,

Maybe like this..

After a disgraceful decision in last nights game coach Rang's plead for rematch is denied.

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ITR, great to see you join in!

Just a small request - If possible, could you provide a small glossary of the individual terms as well, similar to what I did above? All that is needed is a bit of cut and paste from the thai2english.com generated page and indicating their meaning, something like this:

ชี้เหตุ = [H]chii [L]heed ... This is typical newspaper jargon. I still do not have a good translation for it, and thai2english does not combine the two as one expression in their division either. The basic construction is easy enough - ชี้ = to point (out); indicate; mark; show; direct + เหตุ = cause, reason; by reason of; due to.

อัปยศ [L]ab [L]bpa [H]yod = defamed ; shameful ; disgraceful ; ignominious

ถ่วงความเจริญ [L]thuang [M]khwaam [L;M]ja-roen= obstruct(ive); hinder

โค้ช หรั่ง [H]khood [L]rang = Coach Rang

ยัน [M]yan = insist; verify; confirm; attest

นัด 2 [M]nad [R]sawng = นัด = date. นัด 2 = second leg; second game/match

ไม่มี เอา คืน = there will be no retaliation; revenge

I cheated a little, and asked my patient wife for advice about this headline and article, as it was complete jibberish when I first tried to decode it. She broke it down for me thus:

1. (somebody) points out an obstructive disgrace (crap English, but bear with me) This "disgrace" refers to the referee giving Singapore a penalty because one of their players feigned being attacked, which Coach Rang thought was not the case.

2. Coach Rang insists that Thailand will not retaliate for this in the second leg

This section of the article supports her interpretation:

โค้ช หรั่ง ยืนยัน ด้วยว่า หลังจาก เดินทาง กลับ ประเทศไทย ใน วันนี้ แล้ว จะ ให้ ลูกทีม พัก 1 วันก่อน เรียก เข้า แคมป์ เก็บตัว เตรียมตัว เล่น ใน นัด ที่สอง ต่อไป ตามปกติ เวลา นี้ ลูกทีม ทำใจ ได้ แล้ว และ จะ ไม่มี การ เอา คืน เด็ดขาด จะ เอาชนะ ด้วย ฟุตบอล เรื่อง ที่ เกิดขึ้น ความผิด ไม่ได้ มาจาก นักเตะ

Freely translated:

Furthermore, Coach Rang insists that after having returned to Thailand today, he will let the team rest for 1 day and then call them to the camp to focus and prepare for the second leg as usual. At this time, the team has accepted what has happened, and there will be no retaliation whatsoever - they will win by playing football, and the incident can not be blamed on the players.

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ITR, great to see you join in!

Just a small request - If possible, could you provide a small glossary of the individual terms as well, similar to what I did above? All that is needed is a bit of cut and paste from the thai2english.com generated page and indicating their meaning, something like this:

ชี้เหตุ = [H]chii [L]heed ... This is typical newspaper jargon. I still do not have a good translation for it, and thai2english does not combine the two as one expression in their division either. The basic construction is easy enough - ชี้ = to point (out); indicate; mark; show; direct + เหตุ = cause, reason; by reason of; due to.

อัปยศ [L]ab [L]bpa [H]yod = defamed ; shameful ; disgraceful ; ignominious

ถ่วงความเจริญ [L]thuang [M]khwaam [L;M]ja-roen= obstruct(ive); hinder

โค้ช หรั่ง [H]khood [L]rang = Coach Rang

ยัน [M]yan = insist; verify; confirm; attest

นัด 2 [M]nad [R]sawng = นัด = date. นัด 2 = second leg; second game/match

ไม่มี เอา คืน = there will be no retaliation; revenge

I cheated a little, and asked my patient wife for advice about this headline and article, as it was complete jibberish when I first tried to decode it. She broke it down for me thus:

1. (somebody) points out an obstructive disgrace (crap English, but bear with me) This "disgrace" refers to the referee giving Singapore a penalty because one of their players feigned being attacked, which Coach Rang thought was not the case.

2. Coach Rang insists that Thailand will not retaliate for this in the second leg

This section of the article supports her interpretation:

โค้ช หรั่ง ยืนยัน ด้วยว่า หลังจาก เดินทาง กลับ ประเทศไทย ใน วันนี้ แล้ว จะ ให้ ลูกทีม พัก 1 วันก่อน เรียก เข้า แคมป์ เก็บตัว เตรียมตัว เล่น ใน นัด ที่สอง ต่อไป ตามปกติ เวลา นี้ ลูกทีม ทำใจ ได้ แล้ว และ จะ ไม่มี การ เอา คืน เด็ดขาด จะ เอาชนะ ด้วย ฟุตบอล เรื่อง ที่ เกิดขึ้น ความผิด ไม่ได้ มาจาก นักเตะ

Freely translated:

Furthermore, Coach Rang insists that after having returned to Thailand today, he will let the team rest for 1 day and then call them to the camp to focus and prepare for the second leg as usual. At this time, the team has accepted what has happened, and there will be no retaliation whatsoever - they will win by playing football, and the incident can not be blamed on the players.

No probs Meadish, I will add a breakdown and some definitions too.

Thanks for the help (and to your girlfriend too)

I did not know that ไม่มี เอา คืน = there will be no retaliation; revenge Can or could be used like that. I have always used it as (nothing to return)

I like your translation though.

But I reckon (not 100%) that if ไม่มี เอา คืน can be used as revenge I reckon it could be used as repeated.

So how does this sound?

Coach Rang insists that the disgraceful events that marred last nights game will not be repeated when they clash in the 2nd leg.(or next game)

ITR :o

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ID: 25   Posted (edited)

annon and meadish sweetbal...

I would like to explain about "ยิงดับ". It means that the worker was shoot dead. However, the writer used ยิงดับ even though the worker was not dead. It is totally wrong. However, the writer intented to write it that way for exaggerating the story. Thairath often does this. I , and many other Thais, feel that Thairath is not a good source of information because they always exaggerate the headline or even the details inside. If you read Thairath more often, you will learn that the writer know about the story very well (too much details) just like that the writer was at the scene. However, we know that some bad writers just make it up based on just some information they got. They put their opinions or their guess about the story in their writing. There is a phrase in Thai to describe this action as "นั่งเทียนเขียนข่าว".

Edited by jeabsun

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annon and meadish sweetbal...

I would like to explain about "??????". It means that the worker was shoot dead. However, the writer used ?????? even though the worker was not dead. It is totally wrong. However, the writer intented to write it that way for exaggerating the story. Thairath often does this. I , and many other Thais, feel that Thairath is not a good source of information because they always exaggerate the headline or even the details inside. If you read Thairath more often, you will learn that the writer know about the story very well (too much details) just like that the writer was at the scene. However, we know that some bad writers just make it up based on just some information they got. They put their opinions or their guess about the story in their writing. There is a phrase in Thai to describe this action as "??????????????????".

Khun Jeabsun:

Fantastic! Could you please translate that? I read it literally as "sit on a candle and write the news" or "stick a candle up your butt and just invent the news."

But I'm probably missing something.

This is a vital idiom for me to know, as I'm a journalist, and I could probably use it several times a day.

Cheers.

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I think it is much more akin to 'burning the midnight oil' - i.e. they compose headlines late at night, by candlelight (implying insufficient lighting, a metaphor for unclarity) - implying mistakes easily slip in.

Sayings and idioms often deviate from formal grammar - much like the shorthand of newspaper headlines. Hence the lack of preposition between นั่ง and เทียน. Note also the proximity rhyme between เทียน and เขียน - very commonly used in traditional Thai poetry and song lyrics.

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I think it is much more akin to 'burning the midnight oil' - i.e. they compose headlines late at night, by candlelight (implying insufficient lighting, a metaphor for unclarity) - implying mistakes easily slip in.

Sayings and idioms often deviate from formal grammar - much like the shorthand of newspaper headlines. Hence the lack of preposition between ???? and ?????. Note also the proximity rhyme between ????? and ????? - very commonly used in traditional Thai poetry and song lyrics.

Aw, Meadish, you're no fun.

But I must admit that your translation is probably correct.

I have only recently discovered the rhyming scheme to which you allude, and so am finally beginning to see how that works.

Thanks much.

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I think it is much more akin to 'burning the midnight oil' - i.e. they compose headlines late at night, by candlelight (implying insufficient lighting, a metaphor for unclarity) - implying mistakes easily slip in.

Sayings and idioms often deviate from formal grammar - much like the shorthand of newspaper headlines. Hence the lack of preposition between นั่ง and เทียน. Note also the proximity rhyme between เทียน and เขียน - very commonly used in traditional Thai poetry and song lyrics.

Well, Khun Meadish, that is not correct.

นั่งเทียน means to sit staring at a the candle-fire. It's used when someone who claim that they can see the future or whatever which had happened in the past or future by watching through the water in the alms-bowl of a monk which has candles lighten and put them around the alms-bowl. When it's used with journalists, นั่งเทียนเขียนข่าว means that journalist had made up a story by without knowing the true story.

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I think it is much more akin to 'burning the midnight oil' - i.e. they compose headlines late at night, by candlelight (implying insufficient lighting, a metaphor for unclarity) - implying mistakes easily slip in.

Sayings and idioms often deviate from formal grammar - much like the shorthand of newspaper headlines. Hence the lack of preposition between ???? and ?????. Note also the proximity rhyme between ????? and ????? - very commonly used in traditional Thai poetry and song lyrics.

Well, Khun Meadish, that is not correct.

????????? means to sit staring at a the candle-fire. It's used when someone who claim that they can see the future or whatever which had happened in the past or future by watching through the water in the alms-bowl of a monk which has candles lighten and put them around the alms-bowl. When it's used with journalists, ?????????????????? means that journalist had made up a story by without knowing the true story.

Wow, thanks Khun Yoot.

So important to have someone who can fill in the context when needed.

Actually, I had thought that Meadish's supposition was pretty good, in that sense of the image of journos working on a late deadline but lacking the real facts, and then just making it up, rather than holding the story until they could find out what the real facts are.

But now that you've explained the meaning of the compound word, it makes even more sense.

I'm indebted to you both for steering me away from the tendency to look for a direct word-by-word translation - which is nearly always foolhardy.

In any event, I can add one bit of context to all of this from my own area of expertise in the profession: when bad journalists invent stories (whether it be from the deadline pressure, as suggested by Meadish; or simply divining it, as Yoot says; or just being lazy and incompetent), we say "he never lets the facts get in the way of a good story."

Cheers.

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I think it is much more akin to 'burning the midnight oil' - i.e. they compose headlines late at night, by candlelight (implying insufficient lighting, a metaphor for unclarity) - implying mistakes easily slip in.

Sayings and idioms often deviate from formal grammar - much like the shorthand of newspaper headlines. Hence the lack of preposition between นั่ง and เทียน. Note also the proximity rhyme between เทียน and เขียน - very commonly used in traditional Thai poetry and song lyrics.

Well, Khun Meadish, that is not correct.

นั่งเทียน means to sit staring at a the candle-fire. It's used when someone who claim that they can see the future or whatever which had happened in the past or future by watching through the water in the alms-bowl of a monk which has candles lighten and put them around the alms-bowl. When it's used with journalists, นั่งเทียนเขียนข่าว means that journalist had made up a story by without knowing the true story.

I see - that makes sense now that you explain it. You learn something new every day. Thank you for the correction. :o

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It's good to see that Yoot is keeping a friendly and informative eye on the forum.

Here's one I saw yesterday in the paper, it's not a headline and I guess the origin is Chinese. Does it mean something like familiar with so don't want to punish?

ฃูเอี๋ย the sentence was มีพฤติการรณ์ประนีประนอม ฃูเอียต่ออำนาจเก่า

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It's good to see that Yoot is keeping a friendly and informative eye on the forum.

Here's one I saw yesterday in the paper, it's not a headline and I guess the origin is Chinese. Does it mean something like familiar with so don't want to punish?

ฃูเอี๋ย the sentence was มีพฤติการรณ์ประนีประนอม ฃูเอียต่ออำนาจเก่า

ซูเอี๋ย is from Teochew dialect , it's used as a loan word which means the same as สมยอม in Thai. To translate the meaning to English, it should be to connive or to agree with one another.

For the sentence on the news, it means to have a compromise behavior and agree with the old power( Thaksin's government). Well, it might not completely correct since I don't know the whole context. But hope this helps. :o

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It's good to see that Yoot is keeping a friendly and informative eye on the forum.

Here's one I saw yesterday in the paper, it's not a headline and I guess the origin is Chinese. Does it mean something like familiar with so don't want to punish?

ฃูเอี๋ย the sentence was มีพฤติการรณ์ประนีประนอม ฃูเอียต่ออำนาจเก่า

ซูเอี๋ย is from Teochew dialect , it's used as a loan word which means the same as สมยอม in Thai. To translate the meaning to English, it should be to connive or to agree with one another.

For the sentence on the news, it means to have a compromise behavior and agree with the old power( Thaksin's government). Well, it might not completely correct since I don't know the whole context. But hope this helps. :o

_____________________________________

The following is from this weekend's Matichon Weekend:

"ในทางกลับกัน แม้จะเล่น "บทบู๊" แต่ดูเหมือนสถานการณ์ร้อนทางการเมืองจะลดอุณหภูมิลงอย่างน่าอัศจรรย์ ทั้งที่หลายคนคาดการณ์กันไว้ถึงขนาดต้องมีเลือดตกยางออกกันบ้าง"

Can anyone tell me what the meaning of 'เล่น "บทบู๊" ' is? Lexitron has บู๊ as:

บู๊ as "to fight"

Def. ชอบต่อสู้โดยใช้กำลัง.

Sample:เธอบู๊ได้กับทุกคนไม่เคยเกรงกลัวหน้าไหนอยู่แล้ว

A second definition is:

บู๊ [N] military

Syn. ฝ่ายบู๊

Def. ขุนนางฝ่ายทหารของจีน.

Sample:เขาเป็นฝ่ายบู๊มือสำคัญของฮ่องเต้องค์นี้

Thanks.

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Can anyone tell me what the meaning of 'เล่น "บทบู๊" ' is?

It means " playing the role of using force or fighting "

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ID: 38   Posted (edited)

What's the meaning of the following portion of a headline in Matichon today:

แฉข่าวแค่โยนหินถามทาง

Edited by DavidHouston

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ยอมรับ " ไมได้ เป็น ผบ.ทบ. " " มนตรี " เปิดใจ ! แฉข่าวแค่โยนหินถามทาง

is the full headline... and like you David, I don't have a clue. แฉ ข่าว means 'to reveal', but as for โยน หิน ถาม ทาง I don't know.

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i think it means , "testing the waters" , "seeing how the land lies".

throwing stones to see if the road is solid enough to walk down , if the puddles are deep , clearing the way of snakes etc.

montri is releasing a teaser, and will decide on future actions depending on the response.

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