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george

Veera Sentenced To Eight Years In Cambodian Jail

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Now , if only the Thai powers that be do the same to the rest of the rabble rousers , they will not only prove they are in charge , but will restore some semblance of law and order to the country . Without drastic action such as this , few of their other ongoing problems are likely to go away in time to prevent dire results that these clowns could bring to Thailand .

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Hold onto your hats. This could get quite interesting.

As for convoluted Thai soap opera endings, what odds Thaksin to call up a few old buddies to get him released? And just when you say, it could never happen, just remember TIT.

Agreed.

At the same time there is no reason for the government to go to bat for these fools on a simple trespassing charge, if the conviction includes spying charges, the interesting point will be; spying for whom?

Espionage is espionage, and it isn't as though a planned small PAD day trip across the border can be dressed up to be in Cambodia's national interest. Doesn't matter if he was doing it provably on anyone's behalf or not I would imagine.

They would presumably have to prove what the actual spying was, however. What Cambodian secrets were compromised or threatened to be compromised by their "spying?"

Espionage on a military base in Cambodia? This so-called military base is 55 meters within a disputed border? Is unfenced and unguarded?

The 7 traveled together into Cambodia's territory for 150 feet or so. 5 are sent on their way with a $250 fines... the other two are sent to prison for 8 and 6 years? Guilty of trespassing, yes. Guilty of espionage? phffft.

What was the espionage?

The phrase "trumped-up charges" come to mind.

.

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Hold onto your hats. This could get quite interesting.

As for convoluted Thai soap opera endings, what odds Thaksin to call up a few old buddies to get him released? And just when you say, it could never happen, just remember TIT.

Agreed.

At the same time there is no reason for the government to go to bat for these fools on a simple trespassing charge, if the conviction includes spying charges, the interesting point will be; spying for whom?

Espionage is espionage, and it isn't as though a planned small PAD day trip across the border can be dressed up to be in Cambodia's national interest. Doesn't matter if he was doing it provably on anyone's behalf or not I would imagine. He picked the wrong fight, at the wrong time, in the wrong place and now he will pay with some time behind bars. Arrogant, stupid and short sighted is the most polite thing I can think to describe the actions of these PAD i****s. They behave as though they are not responsible for the longer term consequences of their actions, but when you put soldiers at each other's throats, it is your fault.

I am not quite sure how much Veera is worth politically, but if the PAD go moggy about this, they will play completely into Thaksin's hands just when it appeared he and his party were dead in the water. The PAD have committed a very very dumb political move for a narrow political aim that now puts Thaksin back front and centre of the situation all over again. And people believed the PAD came from the more educated and sophisticated side of Thailand. If bullets are traded at the border because of this, any Thai blood is on their hands as far as I am concerned. Someone needs to tell them to stay at home and watch their P&Qs for a very long while.

I don't think it will take long until we get the headlines that "Thaksin offers to negotiate to free Veera". Maybe a day or so at most.

Could you imagine the political mileage that is worth? Abhisit and the government will look completely toothless. What can the army say about it? Thaksin on his white charger to defuse all the problems, and I believe it is a real possibility. Do you think Veera has the principles to volunteer to stay in Cambodia if he knows that Thaksin negotiates his release? They have idiotically allowed Thaksin back to the table. Idiots. Idiots. Idiots.

The PAD will deliver a get out of jail free card to Thaksin if they kick up a stink about this.

Agreed yet again.

It amazes me, even after so many years here, the lack of forethought that is so typical in so many quarters of society. Short sighted self-interest that far too often screws the pooch of long term self-interest, and not coincidentally the good of Thailand. So sad to watch sometimes.

Veera has the principles to volunteer to stay in Cambodia if he knows that Thaksin negotiates his release?

Not on his best day.

Thaksin coming on his smog gray charger, sure as shooting.

How effectively is another issue.

Hun sen will only bite IF he thinks Thaksin will be his new negotiating partner over the oil. I have believed for some time, big oil interests /Thaksin friends have been clandestinely financing the otherwise moribund PAD, and more so TPN, for exactly an outcome such as this, pushing them one way, with them not knowing who is pushing, or why, but glad to have the cash to keep their game on.

The sports agents and Fed Investigators say: Follow the money.

I don't think they have played into Thaksins hands,

I think they have been played.

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Of course, Abhisit might come to the rescue and organise a trade. It's all been planned to get the yellows on Abhisit's side. :whistling:

What does Abhisit have to trade? Maybe Kasit?

A seat at the big boys table is the likely demand they have in mind.

But it would be more than a bit stupid to give it to them.

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Any information on the specifics of the espionage conviction?

In what form did the spying take? What secret information were they gathering?

What did these 2 do that was different from the 5 that were with them the whole time and were only found guilty of trespassing?

.

I thought they were repeat offenders.

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Any information on the specifics of the espionage conviction?

In what form did the spying take? What secret information were they gathering?

What did these 2 do that was different from the 5 that were with them the whole time and were only found guilty of trespassing?

I thought they were repeat offenders.

Repeat offenders for trespass. Not for spying.

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Any information on the specifics of the espionage conviction?

In what form did the spying take? What secret information were they gathering?

What did these 2 do that was different from the 5 that were with them the whole time and were only found guilty of trespassing?

I thought they were repeat offenders.

They've never been convicted of espionage before, only trespassing.

In fact, I'd be curious if any Thai has previously been convicted of espionage anywhere, let alone a man and woman spy team.

And add, has anyone from any country ever been previously convicted of espionage by Cambodia?

What possible military secrets could they have been trying to gather in this area? How many cows there were?

.

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Any information on the specifics of the espionage conviction?

In what form did the spying take? What secret information were they gathering?

What did these 2 do that was different from the 5 that were with them the whole time and were only found guilty of trespassing?

I thought they were repeat offenders.

They've never been convicted of espionage before, only trespassing.

In fact, I'd be curious if any Thai has previously been convicted of espionage anywhere, let alone a man and woman spy team.

And add, has anyone from any country ever been previously convicted of espionage by Cambodia?

What possible military secrets could they have been trying to gather in this area? How many cows there were?

.

Out of curiosity why are you all of a sudden defending people who have no good intentions. They both knew it was a piece of Cambodian territory they were interning. They knew before hand that there were causing trouble and yet they went. What possible good could this type of action do Thailand?

Buchholz

you are normally good at research. Instead of trying to defend them why don't you go over the records of the trial and find out why they were convicted.

for myself I believe they deserved the time even if they weren't spying. We have the yellow shirts actively pursuing war and these clowns pull a stunt like that. And why did they do it on a military base?

Being as it was there second offense they had to know Cambodia would not turn the cheek a second time.

Don't know where you come from but where I come from there is a saying. [if you can't do the time don't do the crime]

It is one thing to play there silly little games in Thailand. (where it is becoming the national pastime) But to deliberately and illegally play it in another country if not doing espionage for Thailand it could be considered treason trying to get Thailand into trouble on the international scene. Just a thought but give it a little bit of consideration.B)

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Hold onto your hats. This could get quite interesting.

As for convoluted Thai soap opera endings, what odds Thaksin to call up a few old buddies to get him released? And just when you say, it could never happen, just remember TIT.

Agreed.

At the same time there is no reason for the government to go to bat for these fools on a simple trespassing charge, if the conviction includes spying charges, the interesting point will be; spying for whom?

Espionage is espionage, and it isn't as though a planned small PAD day trip across the border can be dressed up to be in Cambodia's national interest. Doesn't matter if he was doing it provably on anyone's behalf or not I would imagine.

They would presumably have to prove what the actual spying was, however. What Cambodian secrets were compromised or threatened to be compromised by their "spying?"

Espionage on a military base in Cambodia? This so-called military base is 55 meters within a disputed border? Is unfenced and unguarded?

The 7 traveled together into Cambodia's territory for 150 feet or so. 5 are sent on their way with a $250 fines... the other two are sent to prison for 8 and 6 years? Guilty of trespassing, yes. Guilty of espionage? phffft.

What was the espionage?

The phrase "trumped-up charges" come to mind.

.

Unusual for you Buchholz a liitle sympathy for our intruder friends. Maybe a colour of your liking. I agree why charge some with more serious charges...just <deleted> shoot them all and have done with it. Waste of space army sponsored nationalists.

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playtime is over now.....it's a signal fot those thailand clowns with an attitude.

no matter what color their shirt is.

7 cambodian politicians entering thailand (or a disputed area).....imagine that.....

the thais would have done exactly the same

hun sen keeps them as bargain and after releasing those 2 idiots in the near future he is the political messiah (again).

and of course he will praise himself for that generous gesture on state tv.

TiT

TiC

:lol:

btw, the thai army brought some howitzers to the border area today (maybe they want to bomb them free)

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Sounds like the Cambodians are trying to provoke the Thais. Will be interesting to see how the Thais respond...

Or conversely, and likely more correctly, to warn the Thais to stop provoking them.

That's it animatic. Good point, well made.

The Thais are playing a dangerous political game. It's not just the PAD engineering this spat; the Army are involved and probably Abhisit's government I wonder if this could all be connected to the possible postponement of the election, due to proposed electoral changes not being ready, that was mooted today. A military stand off with a neighbouring country could seal it: The military are still afraid of Abhisit losing despite closing down all the Puea Thai TVand Radio Stations and banning from politics or jailing most of the party leaders who can string more than 2 sentences together.

Instead of worring about a 100m stretch of border that might be at issue, why not concentrate on lifting the economy of the major part of the Isaan that the Thais do control out of abject poverty?

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Unusual for you Buchholz a liitle sympathy for our intruder friends. Maybe a colour of your liking. I agree why charge some with more serious charges...just <deleted> shoot them all and have done with it. Waste of space army sponsored nationalists.

Shoot them all? Sorry can't have that. Before you know it the PAD / TPN will get Amsterdam & Peroff LLP to file a case against the government to demonstrate that a substantial basis exists to believe that the following international crimes within the ambit of the ICC were committed in connection with the suppression of the RedYellow Shirt demonstrations ... bla, bla, blablabla ....

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Any information on the specifics of the espionage conviction?

In what form did the spying take? What secret information were they gathering?

What did these 2 do that was different from the 5 that were with them the whole time and were only found guilty of trespassing?

I thought they were repeat offenders.

They've never been convicted of espionage before, only trespassing.

In fact, I'd be curious if any Thai has previously been convicted of espionage anywhere, let alone a man and woman spy team.

And add, has anyone from any country ever been previously convicted of espionage by Cambodia?

Out of curiosity why are you all of a sudden defending people who have no good intentions. They both knew it was a piece of Cambodian territory they were interning. They knew before hand that there were causing trouble and yet they went. What possible good could this type of action do Thailand?

Buchholz

you are normally good at research. Instead of trying to defend them why don't you go over the records of the trial and find out why they were convicted.

for myself I believe they deserved the time even if they weren't spying. We have the yellow shirts actively pursuing war and these clowns pull a stunt like that. And why did they do it on a military base?

Being as it was there second offense they had to know Cambodia would not turn the cheek a second time.

Don't know where you come from but where I come from there is a saying. [if you can't do the time don't do the crime]

It is one thing to play there silly little games in Thailand. (where it is becoming the national pastime) But to deliberately and illegally play it in another country if not doing espionage for Thailand it could be considered treason trying to get Thailand into trouble on the international scene. Just a thought but give it a little bit of consideration.B)

I'm only curious as to what on Earth they could possibly be convicted of regarding espionage. I'm not defending their trespassing.

I don't see that is so wrong that criminal action has the appropriate penalty adjudicated, but 8 years for crossing an unmarked/disputed border is taking the piss, even for a repeat offender.

8 years is certainly a reasonable punishment for a true case of espionage, but there is a distinct dearth of information available as to exactly what form that espionage took.

Typically espionage is conducted to uncover military secrets. Does Cambodia have military secrets in this area? What is this military base you speak of? As far as I can see from the various videos that were filmed, the area showed was a dismal dusty farmland with not much else.

The other discrepancy involved in this case is that it was a group of 7 that were all traveling together. I've not read any reports that the 2 broke off from the other 5 and went somewhere else. If that's the case, why were only these 2 charged with espionage?

This wasn't their second case of espionage, only trespassing.

As said, they shouldn't have gone there, but to punish them with fake charges of espionage is just bogus. To send them off to prison for that length of time is even more bogus. They aren't the Rosenbergs.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julius_and_Ethel_Rosenberg

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just <deleted> shoot them all and have done with it

Your intelligent contribution is duly noted and discarded.

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just <deleted> shoot them all and have done with it

Your intelligent contribution is duly noted and discarded.

Only having a larf . Dont shoot em... just pray they were trespassing in a minefield

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just <deleted> shoot them all and have done with it

Your intelligent contribution is duly noted and discarded.

Only having a larf . Dont shoot em... just pray they were trespassing in a minefield

Sorry to disappoint your lust for blood, but they walked along the same dirt road the other 5 did and the one the villagers use.

but apparently somewhere along this unfenced, unguarded dusty trail exists a secret Cambodian military base. :rolleyes:

.

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Unusual for you Buchholz a liitle sympathy for our intruder friends. Maybe a colour of your liking. I agree why charge some with more serious charges...just <deleted> shoot them all and have done with it. Waste of space army sponsored nationalists.

Why indeed? Surely you haven't done a Rubi and rediscovered the old yellow polo shirt beneath a pile of dust in your closet?

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Taksin has been rather too cosily in bed with the Cambodians and Burmese to fairly represent Thai interests. More a case of putting his business interests ahead of his real priorities when he was PM. Which begs the question: is he really a patriot? Also the 2000 border agreement thing was instigated by him because of his (sic. conflict of interest) business with Cambodia. I do remember there was a lot of controversy about it at the time.

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I'm only curious as to what on Earth they could possibly be convicted of regarding espionage. I'm not defending their trespassing.

I don't see that is so wrong that criminal action has the appropriate penalty adjudicated, but 8 years for crossing an unmarked/disputed border is taking the piss, even for a repeat offender.

8 years is certainly a reasonable punishment for a true case of espionage, but there is a distinct dearth of information available as to exactly what form that espionage took.

Typically espionage is conducted to uncover military secrets. Does Cambodia have military secrets in this area? What is this military base you speak of? As far as I can see from the various videos that were filmed, the area showed was a dismal dusty farmland with not much else.

The other discrepancy involved in this case is that it was a group of 7 that were all traveling together. I've not read any reports that the 2 broke off from the other 5 and went somewhere else. If that's the case, why were only these 2 charged with espionage?

This wasn't their second case of espionage, only trespassing.

As said, they shouldn't have gone there, but to punish them with fake charges of espionage is just bogus. To send them off to prison for that length of time is even more bogus. They aren't the Rosenbergs.

http://en.wikipedia....Ethel_Rosenberg

Wasn't the salient point that they were in possession of the video camera? A lot of countries get touchy about filming around military bases. As for the " dismal dusty farmland," what else is there for 50 miles in any direction?

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Sorry to disappoint your lust for blood, but they walked along the same dirt road the other 5 did and the one the villagers use.

but apparently somewhere along this unfenced, unguarded dusty trail exists a secret Cambodian military base. :rolleyes:

Probably a leftover and forgotten part of the infamous HoChiMinh trail ;)

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BANGKOK 27 May 2017 01:46
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