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george

Veera Sentenced To Eight Years In Cambodian Jail

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lovelomsak    3,747

A few years back a bunch of Iranian diplomats were expelled from the US for taking pics of bridges etc in NY. It always depends who you are, what you represent or are perceived as representing and where you are from.

Posturing

Precisely

He was without portfolio, on his own, entering internationally disputed territory claimed by both another country and his own.

it was not an official delegation pre-arranged through diplomatic channels to find facts, he did it on his own.

It was a military area, and this was stated well before, and he entered it and took pictures.

A military area need not be fenced in to still be a military area.

He entered an area he knew to be controlled by a foreign power,

while disputing that countries control, with no authority to do so.

He is known to be publicly hostile to Cambodia and to dispute Cambodia's sovereignty of the land.

There are so many reasons for them to slap him down hard it's astounding he didn't get MORE TIME.

PAD of course are going ballistic over this, but he made his own bed and must join the bedbugs for some time.

Exactly. I feel this post should answer all questions about his charge and conviction. He kicked the dog and the dog bit him.

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Buchholz    2,952

I didn't mean to imply that I believed the Cambodian charges were posturing, rather that the context of who the guy was, where he was going, the intent of what he was doing, and the fact that he recorded it, possibly covertly, opens him up very easily to the accusation of espionage.

Not so covertly if it ended up on youtube with a video of him with a palmcorder in his hands. Ratree is also shown with a camera in this video.

But who was filming the two of them filming? How did that person escape a prison sentence.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AMwxh0zjX1M&feature=related

I can see how one might mistake the dry scrubland for dry scrubland and not the secret base it really is.

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Buchholz    2,952

Espionage can be loosly defined as the seeking of information about one's enemies or rivals. It does not have to be making plans of military installations, it could be just chatting to locals to get an idea of how the think and feel about certain matters. Civilian morale is just as important as military power.

Very loosely if chatting up the local farmers to find out how long they've lived there (as per the first video) is considered "espionage."

.

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Buchholz    2,952

A few years back a bunch of Iranian diplomats were expelled from the US for taking pics of bridges etc in NY. It always depends who you are, what you represent or are perceived as representing and where you are from.

Posturing

Precisely

He was without portfolio, on his own, entering internationally disputed territory claimed by both another country and his own.

it was not an official delegation pre-arranged through diplomatic channels to find facts, he did it on his own.

It was a military area, and this was stated well before, and he entered it and took pictures.

A military area need not be fenced in to still be a military area.

He entered an area he knew to be controlled by a foreign power,

while disputing that countries control, with no authority to do so.

He is known to be publicly hostile to Cambodia and to dispute Cambodia's sovereignty of the land.

There are so many reasons for them to slap him down hard it's astounding he didn't get MORE TIME.

PAD of course are going ballistic over this, but he made his own bed and must join the bedbugs for some time.

Usually, military bases have military people stationed on them.

Usually, military bases have signs designating them as military bases.

8 years for a stroll down a dirt road (as per the 2nd video) is over the top.

A trespassing charge is justified. An espionage charge is not.

If first offenders get by with a $250 fine, then a second offence might receive 6 months at the most, if not just a higher (perhaps double) fine.

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MUYTHAI    4

And now according to today's Thai Rath newspaper they want to demolish the Khmer temple.

Rule # 1

Don't believe everything you read...and I know you stated 'according to....'. ;)

Eight years is far too long. The sentence is a political statement. Sadly, pedophiles, rapists, murderers, etc. probably get less time, unless it is a politically motivated arrest and sentence. In general, I like Cambodia and its citizens very much but the government is so very corrupt!

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tragickingdom    777

It is a good lesson for a repeat offender. He was arrested before did not got the warning and was out to cause a diplomatic row. I cannot suppress a smile, especially now the people he relied on to make a noise like Suthep and the somewhat strange army commander say that they have accept the term. A typical case of Som Nam Naa

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webfact    24,352

Govt to Pursue Help for Two Jailed in Cambodia

The deputy prime minister in charge of national security urges the People's Alliance for Democracy not to blow up the issue of the two Thai activists jailed in Cambodia as it could intensify conflicts between Thailand and Cambodia.

Deputy Prime Minister Suthep Thaugsuban expressed disappointment over Cambodian court's sentencing of Weera Somkwamkid and Ratree Pipatanapaiboon for border trespassing and espionage.

However, he would not criticize the Cambodian judicial standards and reiterated that the government will continue to find ways to help the two detained Thais.

Suthep added the Thai government believes that the rising tension between the two countries would disrupt the Thai-Cambodian ties.

However, he said Thailand will continue to negotiate with Cambodia and he believed the tense situation will soon subside.

The deputy PM reiterated that the two activists are still able to file an appeal with the Cambodian upper courts and a royal pardon request is entirely up to their choice.

Suthep said he is aware that the situation needs to be handled with care so that it will not cause further rifts between the two countries.

He went on to say that security officials have been ordered to closely watch Government House, Parliament, the Foreign Ministry and the Cambodian Embassy in Bangkok after there have been threats of possible disturbance there.

Asked about the Cambodian government's refusal to take down the flag at the Kaew Sikha Khiri Sawara Temple, the deputy PM said Cambodia has the rigth to do so because the two countries may have differect interpretation on the matter and that the temple was built after the 2000 memorandum of understanding was signed.

tanlogo.jpg

-- Tan Network 2011-02-02

footer_n.gif

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bitterbatter    44

What could he possibly be spying on there? Seeing if there were cambodian troops? We already know there were. Espionage is a ridiculous charge. Something interesting will happen because of this.

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webfact    24,352

Government pledges to continue helping two Thais jailed in Cambodia

BANGKOK, Feb 2 -- Thailand's Deputy Prime Minister Suthep Thaugsuban on Wednesday said he was disappointed that the Cambodian court handed down quite harsh sentences against two Thai citizens for illegal entry, trespassing into a military area and spying charges but the Thai government would continue helping them.

Mr Suthep said he believed the verdict would not affect bilateral relations between the two neighbouring countries and urged the Yellow Shirt activists of the People’s Alliance for Democracy (PAD) not to incite violence. Nonetheless, he said the government has no plan to disperse the protesters.

He also instructed officials to step up security at government offices including Government House, Parliament and the Cambodian embassy in Bangkok.

The Phnom Penh Municipal Court on Tuesday handed down an eight-year jail term and a 1.8 million riel (US$450) fine for Veera Somkwamkid, a coordinator of Thai Patriots Network, and a six-year jail term and a 1.2 million riel (US$300) fine for his secretary Ratree Pipattanapaiboon finding them both guilty of espionage, illegal entry and trespassing in a military zone.

The pair was told they can appeal within 30 days.

Mr Suthep said the legal procedures were not over yet as the pair could appeal and the Thai government would give full support to help them.

The verdict should not be drawn to intensify the rift between Thailand and Cambodia as Thailand should live with the neighbouring country peacefully, said the deputy prime minister.

As for the request for a possible royal pardon, Mr Suthep said it would depend on Mr Veera and Ms Ratree themselves to make such a decision, but if they decided so the government would facilitate and discuss it with Cambodian authorities.

He affirmed that the relations between Thailand and Cambodia are still at a level at which amends can be made.

The deputy prime minister commented as the PAD threatened to mobilise more supporters Saturday to step up pressure on the government to help free Mr Veera and Ms Ratree.

The PAD has encamped near Government House since Tuesday to protest the government's handling of the border disputes with Cambodia. (MCOT online news)

tnalogo.jpg

-- TNA 2011-02-02

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animatic    4,436

Espionage could easily be drawn from his stated intent of trying to get information on Cambodia territory, that Cambodians would say are intended to harm Cambodian National Interests. There is also economic espionage and that is illegal also in most countries. Examples being PRC Chinese trying to get info on computer advances, technologies in general, missal info and defense capabilities from USA. Cambodia can make a reasonable argument that Veera had intent to discover similar 'defense capabilities, or economic information. Makes little difference how much money is involved.

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DP25    2,562
There is also economic espionage and that is illegal also in most countries. Examples being PRC Chinese trying to get info on computer advances, technologies in general, missal info and defense capabilities from USA. Cambodia can make a reasonable argument that Veera had intent to discover similar 'defense capabilities, or economic information. Makes little difference how much money is involved.

Yes, Cambodia clearly has to protect their vital dirt farm industry

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fnprop    9

A few years back a bunch of Iranian diplomats were expelled from the US for taking pics of bridges etc in NY. It always depends who you are, what you represent or are perceived as representing and where you are from.

Posturing

Precisely

He was without portfolio, on his own, entering internationally disputed territory claimed by both another country and his own.

it was not an official delegation pre-arranged through diplomatic channels to find facts, he did it on his own.

It was a military area, and this was stated well before, and he entered it and took pictures.

A military area need not be fenced in to still be a military area.

He entered an area he knew to be controlled by a foreign power,

while disputing that countries control, with no authority to do so.

He is known to be publicly hostile to Cambodia and to dispute Cambodia's sovereignty of the land.

There are so many reasons for them to slap him down hard it's astounding he didn't get MORE TIME.

PAD of course are going ballistic over this, but he made his own bed and must join the bedbugs for some time.

Exactly. I feel this post should answer all questions about his charge and conviction. He kicked the dog and the dog bit him.

:clap2: :clap2: :clap2: :clap2:

Impunity works so much better when the courts, government, and institutions you'll encounter are your own, not some foreign nation's.:violin:

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