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BANGKOK 18 November 2018 20:59
MarkGB

Complicated life! Thai girlfriend twice denied UK visa, now married, next step?

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This may be a little complicated, but thank you for reading.

 

My then girlfriend but now wife (from Thailand) was turned down for two UK tourist visas in August and November last year, but family considerations back home mean I have to continually fly back from Thailand to Europe (due to an ill father in Wales and 11-year old son studying in Paris who has no other child care/support when my ex-wife is working in the school holidays). 

At present, I fly back to London every 6-8 weeks and go to the madhouse that is the Thai embassy to obtain another single entry visa (the Thai Embassy tells me I need £5,000 in my account for a multiple entry visa and I have too many monthly outgoings for that to be the case).

In the short-term, a tourist visa for my wife (we married in December – in an Amphur Office) or anything that would allow my wife to spend some time with my family and I in the UK (even a month) would be extremely helpful and less costly than the current arrangement.

I have the money and home to support her in London (which I have proven 100% on both tourist visas – with no objections), but the visas were turned down for the following reasons.

1 She has no job in Thailand (I rent an apartment for us in Bangkok - six-month contract, at present - while her dad has a successful business and large home). She has a qualification in marketing, but has lived with me in Thailand while we've been a couple.

2 She has ‘no reason to ever return to Thailand’ because her son from a previous relationship some years ago lives with his Thai father (she currently talks to her son on the phone most days).

3 On the first visa application, a Thai person from the UK embassy called her and asked if she had ever worked in Pattaya. It was 8am and her initial response was “No, Jomtien”, before correcting herself and that was taken as lying and the hiding of something sinister. She worked on the reception of a hotel in the Arab part of Pattaya en route to Jomtien rather than the centre. Regardless, hardly a crime. The second visa application used this as a major reason for refusal.

My wife and I have been a couple since March 2015 (met in Hong Kong) provable by photos, travel, hotel receipts etc and I have visited Thailand 11 times since. We were previously friends online for a couple of years (October 2012), but the Thai people in the UK embassy have at times intentionally or unintentionally assumed that as being the start of a full relationship despite lucid assurances that was not the case.

Both applications were through supposedly ‘reliable’ and personally recommended visa companies, but next time I will apply myself as was my original intention.

Any advice? I’m just trying to balance a complicated life and not looking to pull off the scam of the century.

Thank you for taking a look. Any guidance would be much appreciated.

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If you applied when not married then I think generally they want proof the relationship has lasted at least two years. They also I believe like to see some foreign travel experience.

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1 hour ago, Jeddah Jo said:

If you applied when not married then I think generally they want proof the relationship has lasted at least two years.

Not for a visit visa; only for settlement as unmarried partners.

 

1 hour ago, Jeddah Jo said:

They also I believe like to see some foreign travel experience.

Can help if the applicant has visited other countries and complied with the conditions of their visa: but not essential.

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I'm sure 7by7 is right, Mark, you just have to address the issues raised in the last refusal notice in her next application, in particular explaining the confusion about Pattaya/Jomtien (and, as you say, don't use an agency for this), and make the application as positive and truthful as possible.  Good luck.

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If you have future plans such as applying for a settlement visa to the UK or you living in Thailand then use this to provide a bigger picture may help.

An ECO has to work on the balance of probabilities that the applicant will return.

Some have included a statement along the lines that she will return within the conditions of the visa in order not to jeopardise a future settlement application.

Visas are not refused based on previous application refusals. Generally refused because the original grounds have not been adequately covered in subsequent applications.

As suggested above it may be worth posting a picture of the refusal notice after removing anything that identifies the applicant. There are not many refusals we have not seen before!

Edited by bobrussell
poor English!

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Thank you very much for the appreciated replies. It seems to be as I suspected... a long road ahead! Attached is the latest refusal letter, but it's inaccurate in a few ways and felt like a skimmed, rubber-stamped 'no'. I have always said I will pay for all costs (full bank statements, pay slips, home ownership in London etc proved this is possible) but for some strange reason that become 'some' in the second refusal. Also 'a number of discrepancies' on employment was really one Jomtien and not Pattaya in the phone call on the first visa 'no' (there was no call for the second visa though she waited by the phone every morning). She has had a job in two family markets and for a trading company that went bust, but since I came to be with her has stayed with me, outside of working in the market with her dad.

 

We were friends from late 2012, but again postmarked envelopes from the UK when we were not a couple were ignored. A relationship was only claimed since March 2015 as before we were casual friends. There seems to be a bemusing assumption of criminality or wrong-doing which would mean (A) I was faking 100s of photographs and spending thousands of pounds in travel before I initiate my evil masterplan or (B) she is planning to channel her inner Usain Bolt and sprint out of Heathrow Airport to pluck £50 notes off an English money tree. Essentially, they only want Thai people from wealthy families to travel? It does feel a bit prejudiced. She can, of course, get a job, but how many (non market) employers allow staff to visit England for weeks/months? 

Visapage1.JPG

Visapage 2.JPG

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markgb as stated you must correct the reasons in your first 2 refusals... I was in the same boat as you a couple of years ago and failed also for 2 visit visas... but now have my wife with me in the uk... first thing is apply for a month visit and not a 3 month one as that will not work I tried it and failed ..

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'There still appears to be some confusion regarding my employment. I apologise if I appeared vague and confused but it was my intention at all times to be accurate.

My employment history was ...............'

 

The rest is fairly neutral waffle. Many partners/spouses are supported by their partners and do not have or need employment. The applicant cannot be penalised on these grounds alone.

 

The issue appears to be credibility so it is essential that the information is factually correct and the applicant is thoroughly aware of what is in the application.

Edited by bobrussell
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Welcome to my world !!

I applied first time and the only reason they turned my wife down was she only provided 3 months bank statements not the 6 they asked for. Despite the fact I was paying for everything and owned my uk house outright and had supporting bank statements to prove I could afford it.

That was a slight disappointment so left it for about 4 years before applying again as no great hurry to go to UK.

Second time filled everything out and she took it to the office and spoke with woman for around 15 minutes.

Then got the reply letter with the biggest pile of s**t I have ever read in it !!

They said they did not think we were married despite us being married for 8 years and providing letters from people who came from uk to our wedding and photos off us on holiday and at our house together.

They said she did not have the funds for a return flight !! She had over 1.2m in her bank for over a year !!

They said they thought she wouldn't come back. Despite her giving proof she owned a new car paid for and 2 properties valued at 25m bht in her name.

The last thing they said was there was no proof off my visa information. I had given them this as I printed it off and signed it and she had given them my passport also !!

I appealed and the appeal was sent to Vietnam to be decided !! Email then sent saying try again to me !!

Then last year my friend married a woman with no assets money nothing and used a visa company. 3 days after handing it in she was given a 6 month visa for the UK.

Then a friend of the guys wife who also had nothing , not even a job . Was asked to go to the Uk for a holiday by a guy she knew from working in a bar before. She was given the money by him to go pay to apply. Week later she got one too !!

Guess if you want it for certain pay a company to make sure the office stamps it !!

Maybe mine was the Monday morning pile where they just pick up one lot and say denied to all off them without looking !!

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Do you have any ties to Thailand that she could present to the embassy? 

 

When my husband asked for a US tourist visa, he showed the officer my passport and a letter from my workplace confirming my employment. He basically showed the officer that I would return to Thailand so he had no reason to stay in the US.

 

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why not apply for a visa to live with you in england....if you are husband and wife  dont be applying for 6 months visas.....my Thia partner was also turned down twice trying for 6 mths visas...we we got married we applied again for stelement visa and it was 3rd time lucky.....good luck...nothing is easy these days mind you saying that my wifes first refusal was back in 2004...

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You and your wife need to decide where you both want to live - UK/Europe or SE Asia.

 

If you want to make UK/Europe your home base, most of the good advice has already been given, especially the "get a few stamps from other countries into both of your passports" idea - great if you could have one for Schlengen - bring her to visit your son in Paris, for instance. Also, you need to do more research and pay for expertise - that means get a good quality immigration lawyer on your side and at her side if possible during the interview (if they want to know why you want a lawyer present, use the phrase, "to preserve the veracity of the interview content."). But the big problem is that your lady has no ties in Thailand and so no official is going to agree to give her a visa. She needs a job and an employer who is prepared to state in writing that she is required back at her place of work within X number of weeks. It would also help if she had a car in her name. Even better if she had a condo or some property in her name. It all adds to the boxes that are ticked.

 

If you want to make SE Asia your home base - I say SE Asia as I get the impression that you are having visa troubles re Thailand for some reason. If this is so, you might want to consider basing yourselves in a neighbouring country - Cambodia is easiest where you just buy the one or two year visa at the airport - no questions. Laos might be more suitable for your wife especially if she is from Issan and if Vientiane you are very quickly in Thailand. There are a few hoops for the visa but at least you can get a one month visa on arrival and extend it in country for 30 days in addition and there does not seem to be any limit on that.

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Yep, luck of the draw sometimes. And if one of the office staff got out of wrong side of the bed in the morning. Bad hair day etc etc.

I've known my missus 17 years. Lived with her for 13 odd here. Married her nearly 12 years ago. Mother of my only son, now aged 11. All of us have my sir name. Been to England with me two times previous on holiday, 4-6 weeks at a time on a 6 month tourist visa. 2 years ago got refused for a 3rd holiday for some ridiculous pedantic excuse. All paperwork correct. Appealed, and luckily we managed to all have our 4 week family holiday in the UK.

Sometimes smooth sailing, sometimes a nightmare.

Still pi$$es me off, my son and i have  full Anglo Saxon first and last names, my wife, the mother of my only son has the same Anglo Saxon sir name, mother of a UK citizen, married to a UK citizen for more than a decade, has to go through such a rigmarole and jump through a bunch of hoops for just a simple holiday.

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